Microsoft is alienating part of its customer base - gHacks Tech News

Microsoft is alienating part of its customer base

Microsoft's Windows 10 operating system is a success if you look at the operating system's growth and the use figures that Microsoft releases every now and then.

Windows 10 is doing pretty well right now but it has yet to be determined whether the growth of the operating system has been fueled largely by the free upgrade offer, and if it can stand on its own when the free upgrade offer ends on July 29, 2016.

I know users who are perfectly happy with Windows 10. While you can criticize the operating system for its privacy issues or removed features, the general consensus seems to be that it is a step in the right direction when compared to its predecessor Windows 8.

I also know users who dislike Windows 10 and don't want any part of it. This may come from privacy issues or missing support for specific programs, features or hardware components, and those are all valid reasons for not wanting to upgrade.

Probably the main reason why users don't want to upgrade to Windows 10 is Microsoft's aggressive approach in promoting the operating system.

Most did not mind the Get Windows 10 upgrade offer that Microsoft displayed initially on devices running Windows 7 or 8.1 as it was thought to be a one time thing at that time.

Problems began when the offer was repeated and changed multiple times throughout the short span of the operating system's availability.

Microsoft does not honor user choice

get windows 10 schedule

Microsoft does not honor user choice. Users who say no to Windows 10 -- and not scheduling the upgrade or accepting its download or installation should count as a clear no -- should not be bombarded with additional and modified upgrade prompts.

Apart from throwing multiple prompts at users who clearly did not want their device to be upgraded to Windows 10 the first time Microsoft asked, it is the "how" that is infuriating users.

Windows 10 upgrade prompts are changed all the time which confuses users as they have to find the one -- often hidden or obfuscated -- option to say no to the upgrade.

Hitting the close button of the upgrade prompt window worked previously, but it won't work in the latest version of the prompt for instance. If you don't pay close attention to these prompts, the likelihood is there that you will end up with Windows 10 installed.

Those are borderline malware tactics to get users to upgrade.

Even experienced users are at a loss, as hiding the updates that are responsible for displaying the Get Windows 10 offer is nothing but a temporary solution.

In fact, besides security updates, the updates that Microsoft appears to publish the most for Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 are updates that prepare the operating systems for the upgrade to Windows 10, or push a new version of the Get Windows 10 prompt on those systems.

Some users helped themselves by disabling all updates as Brad Chacos notes over at PCWorld. That option is dangerous if security patches are not downloaded and installed manually when they are released.

While user systems may be safe from being upgraded to Windows 10, since updates that push the new operating system are not downloaded and installed anymore, users will have to spend time downloading and installing security updates manually.

Note: The best option to block Windows 10 on a device running a previous version of Windows is to either use software like Never10 or GWX Control Panel, or configure the system manually for blocking Windows 10.

The main issue for many Microsoft customers who use Windows is that the company does not accept no when it comes to Windows 10, and that its tactics to get users to upgrade to the new operating system are anything but customer friendly.

Many hope that the situation will change once the free upgrade offer expires at the one-year anniversary of Windows 10's public release but Microsoft has not confirmed that this is indeed the case. Microsoft could easily change the free upgrade offer to a discounted upgrade offer prompt instead, but that would probably be more user friendly considering that money would need to change hands.

Another interesting question is how alienated customers will react when they have to pick another operating system, for instance when buying a new PC or the current operating system expires.

Now You: Is Microsoft doing itself a favor here?

Summary
Microsoft is alienating part of its customer base
Article Name
Microsoft is alienating part of its customer base
Description
Microsoft's constant pushing of Windows 10 upgrade notifications and updates on Windows 7 and 8.1 devices is alienating part of the company's customer base.
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Ghacks Technology News
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Comments

  1. concerned netizen said on May 28, 2016 at 7:01 pm
    Reply

    I was so stoked when the betas of Win10 came out and was even happy to put up with the telemetry collection. However now that it’s going to be, (or already is), a ‘for purchase’ product, I expect to be able to have control over it.

    There are a lot of great white-hats out there producing some really good tools to help mitigate some of the privacy concerns, and I sincerely thank them for their efforts, but it’s just too much to keep up with now.

    As long as Microsoft is treating Windows 10 as rental property, I can’t in good faith use it on any of my personal devices or recommend it to others.

    The shame is that Windows 10 is a really cool piece of code; it looks good and works well.

    With that I feel I have 3 options:
    -Linux (which does most of what I need MY systems to do, but still lacks in a few areas for me)
    -Buy some type of Mac offering (does everything I need it too, but can’t really afford it now)
    -Hackintosh (all the benefits of Apple’s OS, without the hardware cost)

    I would gladly pay Apple for the ability to install their OS on more generic PC hardware for the privilege of being spied-on much less. (Their telemetry is easy to turn off!! :P )

    I realize Apple makes most of their cash due to their specialized hardware, but maybe they’re missing the boat on this one…
    They could steal a significant percent of 100 million potential paid software-license customers via ticked-off Windows users wanting to own their OS vs. renting it!! :D

    1. Ashrak007 said on May 29, 2016 at 7:05 pm
      Reply

      The entire software development world is moving to a rental only philosophy due in no small way to Apple’s influence. Microsoft is responding after the fact (as they often due) and catching up and in a very aggressive way. There is plenty of blame to go around. I agree though that MS needs to stop this behavior and soon or the Negative PR is going to outweigh the influx of new devices on their app store (which is still pretty lacking).

  2. Billy Vanilly said on May 28, 2016 at 7:35 pm
    Reply

    I use Linux for browsing and Windows for work because of some programs that don’t exist on Linux. I don’t even have to connect to the net when using Win. That solves all privacy issues for me.

    1. anon said on September 17, 2016 at 9:56 am
      Reply

      +1 this.

  3. Long time fan said on May 28, 2016 at 7:35 pm
    Reply

    I have been a Microsoft fan since the first release of DOS, and a Windows fan since before the release of version 1.1. In all that time, Microsoft had always seemed to listen to it’s customers and provide, with each release, the flexibility and capabilities which best served the users needs. There were some exceptions to this, but usually with good intentions for the users and to move the computing experience forward.

    Windows 10 seems to be another step in the same direction, but the way Microsoft is pushing it with misleading and unethical tricks is unusual, counterproductive, and unnecessary.

  4. Not Miles Mathis said on May 28, 2016 at 8:07 pm
    Reply

    Redmond is a Corp. that got the product Windows™ OS© on almost every PC.
    Same with Intel© and Nvidia™. An opportune reminder here:
    These Corp(oration)s are backed by Government agencies.
    Same with Oracle, Google, Facebook and spooks like Elon Musk.

    1. Daniel said on May 29, 2016 at 2:01 am
      Reply

      Excellent and concise analysis!

    2. Velocity.Wave said on May 29, 2016 at 3:48 pm
      Reply

      What!? “spooks like Elon Musk” ???

      Sure he is no saint, and has made many mistakes in his life. Haven’t we all?

      But… You do realize he is launching rockets into space, at sharply reduced costs, and landing parts of those rockets on barges in the middle of the ocean that are just a few feet across.

      Not to mention that by 2018, he plans to land the first human rated capsule on the surface of Mars — another planet! Also shortly, his space ships and vehicles will be the ONLY means to space for US astronauts (unless America wants to keep hitching rides with the Russians at a high cost).

      SO… If revolutionizing rocket science by selecting and leading a team of awesome aerospace engineers, and computer scientists, allowing them to fling space ships and satellites into orbit, and beyond, are not sufficient accomplishments to impress someone like you, then, well, frankly…

      I really think you’re going to go through the rest of your life constantly critically negative and berating of everyone around you. Nothing, nor anyone, will ever be good enough for you.

      1. No Miles Mathis said on May 29, 2016 at 4:33 pm
        Reply

        “I really think you’re going to go through the rest of your life constantly critically negative and berating of everyone around you. Nothing, nor anyone, will ever be good enough for you.”

        Nice psychological analysis, got to donate some money for that?

        About Elon Musk: his companies have received 5 billion in government subsidies via In-Q-Tel investments. His dodgy career started with $28,000 in a company
        called Zip2. He sold it for 341 million to Compaq, then founded X.com which was merged with Confinity… Xspace does privately something that NASA was doing for itself for years. Tesla? He silenced Eberhard and Tarpenning with cash obtained through mergings and CEO positions that appear nothing more than shady.

      2. Rian said on September 2, 2016 at 4:54 pm
        Reply

        Ilon Mask and all he’s property, rockets etc are bull shit.
        As all that is cheap is shit.
        Russian engines was designed and maded not for cheap, thats why they work meantime cheap solution blast and blast and blast , yesterday was agin blast for Ilon ROCKET:-)
        And dont forget Chine , they started do not cheap space machines, as one is already on the Moon surface, nou US Ilon property:-)0
        What I say? If you go cheaper you are criminal, you designed blasts, killing real people and waste their time.

    3. MdN said on May 29, 2016 at 10:42 pm
      Reply

      It’s SpaceX not Xspace. Elon Musk also founded and sold PayPal, USA has to pay the Russians to transport stuff to ISS which obviously NASA can’t do, and all Tesla patents are free and open source. Off you go.

      1. NoT MdN said on May 30, 2016 at 1:42 am
        Reply

        MdN: ” Elon Musk also founded and sold PayPal.” That is False!
        True is that he merged and got insta-CEO.

        Your spook Elon Musk got miliions of public tax money from In-Q-Tel, CIA venture capital.
        Off You Go, Recruit.

    4. Richard Hind said on August 23, 2016 at 7:33 pm
      Reply

      +No Miles Mathis. My goodness, aren’t you just the unhappiest little soul around, with a truck load of jealously and personal spite!
      What’s troubling you so badly about life that feel this way?
      I don’t exactly fawn all over Musk either, even though I’m South Africa, and feel much of work is senseless such as self driving vehicles. Some people are just workaholics, and usually with brains, but must be hell to work for. Me, I’m a chilled and laid back old surfer from Cape Town. Hit me, kick me, but just don’t rush me! ;-))

  5. BoblyBoo said on May 28, 2016 at 8:18 pm
    Reply

    I’ve loved windows since 2000 days when I switched away from MACs and have never once looked back until Windows 10. It has been nightmarish with hardware issues, horrible automatic updates, and more. My Android phone has become more useful then my desktop computer thanks to windows 10.

  6. dblevins said on May 28, 2016 at 8:27 pm
    Reply

    I loaded Win 10 on my 8.1 laptop last week. Most everything seems to work okay EXCEPT

    a) I can’t get the built-in fingerprint reader to work — Micro$oft doesn’t like ANY driver I find well enough to run it, just well enough to say it is the “latest”. UGHH

    b) the multiple parameters to set the screen display are not enough (or are too many) to get a nice, balanced, readable set of icons and their labels, menus, brower text, etc. Either the text is TOO small or TOO large and most of the time BOTH.

    That is not to say that 1/2 of my programs don’t seem to have a header according to the coloring algorithm M$ uses, their heading is just white or gray, wherther the primary window or a background one, and not consistantly. (oh yeah, Rainmeter gadets are super small under any condition letting me icon lables.)

    BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Micro$oft.

    P.S. I’m keeping my large desktop on Win 7.1 Pro for what now seems like FOREVER — maybe Win 17 will convince me otherwise. I don’t think there could be a security/privacy bug that could convince me to give up and load Win 10 on my primary machine.

    1. seeprime said on May 29, 2016 at 12:50 am
      Reply

      If you have the Windows 7 or 8.1 driver for your fingerprint reader, right mouse click on the driver and set the compatibility to Windows 8 and check it to run as administrator. That works very often on Windows 10, which was supposed to do this automatically. But, since it is buggy a hell, it doesn’t.

    2. JD Straw said on August 21, 2016 at 5:33 pm
      Reply

      I hear you and I totally agree. I’ve been using this Windows products since the days of DOS and on up. Liked all the different versions until Windows 8. My favorites were XP and V.7. I have a desktop with XP, a laptop with V.7, and just purchased about 6 or 7 months ago another laptop which happened to come with the 8.1. I hated it then,and I still hate it. I had no intentions of upgrading to V.10 even if they’d paid ME for using it. In the meantime, for the past 12 months, to keep 10 from bushwhacking my laptops, I downloaded a free software name of GTX (if I remember correctly) to prevent the rape of my laptops by M$ as the horrid Windows 10 would begin installing itself every time I tried to download and install the 8.1 updates I needed. Many times it would not stop downloading itself no matter what I did so I began to hastily remove the battery from the laptops to kill the buzzard! GTX worked and was a lifesaver for me. I do NOT want Windows 10 and since the V7 is supported until 2020 and 8.1 until 2023, I can sit the M$ buzzards out and wait for a better, more user-friendly OS. Unfortunately I’m just a user and not technically astute so I will wait for a better system. Macs are too expensive and I am not even vaguely familiar with Linux although I’ve heard great things about the Mac and about Linux.

  7. george said on May 28, 2016 at 8:27 pm
    Reply

    I think it will be trial offer not discount offer after the free offer expired.
    “Try Windows 10 for 1 week, you can rollback if you don’t like it!”

  8. Carlos said on May 28, 2016 at 8:54 pm
    Reply

    Using Windows 10 is like placing a webcam in the bathroom. I’m not going to pretend otherwise and certainly not give a single entity that much power over my life.

    Switched over to Linux a year ago and the peace of mind is priceless. There are quirks and annoyances with any OS but I’m excited to work thru, find solutions and contribute to an ecosystem that’s working for me and my needs.

    I’ve got a highly integrated terminal now and the flexibility to run WinApps if I choose to (so far I haven’t needed to).

    I’m not suggesting this for anyone else just saying that there are viable options for some. In some cases, the change is worth the effort.

  9. Gary D said on May 28, 2016 at 9:08 pm
    Reply

    I have manual controls, registry settings and Never10 to stop the Win 10 update on my Laptop.
    Also, in Windows Update, I have set “Check for updates but let me choose whether to download and install them”

    TWICE this week, KB3035583 (GWX.exe) has been displayed as available for download. It is shown as Important !
    When I hide it, it is shown in the hidden updates as Recommended !!!!
    KB3035583 has turned up ELEVEN times since last July, and it has been “Important” every time.

    Way to go, Nadella !! Your installation targets must be well down on the projections which your sycophantic Yes men predicted.
    Why don’t you sack them and re-hire the programmers and QA people whom you fired :-)

    1. Jeff-FL said on May 28, 2016 at 10:09 pm
      Reply

      Yep, GWX is malware by just about every definition of the word. It is shameful.

  10. Graham said on May 28, 2016 at 10:01 pm
    Reply

    This is pretty bad for non-techy people, but anyone who reads your blog could easily have taken steps to prevent Windows 10 being installed.

    I’ve never had one of these prompts, or even the taskbar icon. I’m not going especially far out of my way to avoid this stuff, I’ve just done the obvious things like turn off recommended updates. I also remember manually hiding a few telemetry updates. Currently I let Aegis-voat do it all for me, but I lag behind a little on releases so that if there’s a problem I can avoid it.

    Does this stuff make me a genius? No. Does it make everyone else stupid?

    1. A different Martin said on May 29, 2016 at 6:41 am
      Reply

      @ Graham:

      “Does it make everyone else stupid?”

      No, it doesn’t make them stupid. It makes them ordinary users who shouldn’t have to become computer geeks — even mere non-genius computer geeks — in order to protect themselves from Microsoft.

      1. Donna said on May 30, 2016 at 7:54 am
        Reply

        Thank you! Windows 10 was installed w/o my permission and I’ve had a hard time rolling back. Some things don’t seem to work as well since then and I’m at a loss w/o a genius computer geek. I’m angry that Microsoft thinks it can bully me this way!

      2. JD Straw said on August 21, 2016 at 8:13 pm
        Reply

        @Graham…Thank you! My sentiments exactly!

  11. Mike O said on May 28, 2016 at 10:11 pm
    Reply

    To Microsoft Corporation – it is the same as when a woman may say it… No means no!

    What don’t you understand!?

    1. A different Martin said on May 29, 2016 at 6:51 am
      Reply

      Imaginary response from Microsoft: “Absolutely — it’s exactly the same as with women. They say they don’t want it, but you know they really do. They all want it, and once they see how good it is, they’re going to come back begging for more.” [Cue theme from Mad Men.]

  12. Henk van Setten said on May 28, 2016 at 10:43 pm
    Reply

    I agree with the title of this post. Apparently, Microsoft prefers getting angry and frustrated Win10 users over keeping happy and satisfied Win7 users.

    But apart from the forced upgrade tactics, there is a deeper reason why this whole thing is alienating long term users like me (I’ve been working with Windows since 3.1 in the early 1990s).

    This deeper reason lies in the entire concept of Win10. This concept of a deeply cloud-integrated consumption-oriented system may well appeal to a majority of users. It is built on principles and assumptions and goals and priorities that may work fine for many. But still it may be all wrong for some others. These last users are left out in the cold.

    Here are some examples, based (of course) on my own situation and principles.

    ● Microsoft assumes that users will happily trade some data privacy in exchange for convenience. Thus, while allowing to limit telemetry in Win10, they made it impossible to switch this off completely. But in my case, this basic assumption is just plain wrong. I like to make my own decisions in protecting my privacy. Microsoft does not acknowledge this might be a problem for some and does not offer a real solution.

    ● Microsoft assumes that users will happily trade some system control in exchange for safety and uniformity. Thus, while allowing a little “update deferring” in Win10, they made it impossible to accept or refuse system updates selectively or permanently. Again, for me this basic assumption is just plain wrong. I really want to fine-tune my own system to my own liking. Microsoft does not acknowledge this might be a problem for some and does not offer a real solution.

    ● Microsoft assumes that users have high-speed internet and thus have no problems with a system that for many reasons (in-system ads, WinUpdate, OneDrive, Cortana, and more) keeps up- and downloading streams of data continuously. In real life, even in Western Europe some 20% of users are still stuck with slow rural lines for years to come. In my own case, with an average upload speed of 50 Kb/s (yes that is a full minute for one small 3 Mb file) any serious cloud syncing would clog my lines for hours! Yet, apart from the inadequate option of setting WiFi downloading to “metered”, Microsoft does not acknowledge this might be a problem for some and does not offer a real solution.

    ● In connection with the above, Microsoft assumes that users mostly rely on internet for media viewing. Thus, they ruthlessly scrapped Windows Media Center (WMC) from Win10. Again, my own case: I live in a region with no cable TV and my home internet download speed (2,5 Mb/s) does not allow for streaming TV. So for TV, I use a digital DVB-T smartcard antenna tuner. WMC is the only PC software that can decode smartcard pay TV channels (alternatives like Kodi don’t recognize my smartcard, and sadly my Linux PC won’t even recognize the TV tuner). So by an upgrade of my media PC to Win10, I would instantly lose nearly all my TV channels. Microsoft does not acknowledge this might be a problem for some and does not offer a real solution.

    ● Microsoft assumes that with a system given away “for free”, users will happily accept paying yearly fees for apps or else accept viewing intrusive ads by way of payment. For example, they replaced the old simple in-Windows Solitaire app with a new “either-pay-or-view-ads” version. Again, for me this feels just plain wrong — almost like blackmail. I already paid for my plain old Solitaire software when I paid (dearly) for my previous Windows version, and so I feel fully entitled to keep using that older software. But Microsoft does not offer that solution.

    And so I can go on. What alienates me is not just Microsoft’s aggressive upgrading policy. What alienates me is this entire monolithic, inflexible philosophy of Windows 10 as a system. It is a system philosophy that gives me the feeling that I, as a minority user, with my own specific needs, are no longer being taken seriously. The feeling that I, as a decades-long Windows user, now simply do no longer count for Microsoft. Now this is true and deep alienation!

    To overcome this sad feeling of having been thrown to the wayside, I will stop now and seek the comfort and distraction of a classic Solitaire game ;-)

    1. Tom Hawack said on May 29, 2016 at 12:14 pm
      Reply

      I totally subscribe to your review and your conclusion, “[…]this entire monolithic, inflexible philosophy of Windows 10 as a system” which appears indeed as the very source of Microsoft’s policy leading to the facts you detail clearly. Obviously the company is engaged in a new approach of what it considers an OS must be from now on.

      The alternative is simple : accept or refuse. I refuse. I refuse to be part of such a system which is no longer an Operating System only but an OS within an AS or Alienation System. I cannot and will not accept this in the same way (though far more considerable) I closed my Google account when Google decided to “centralize” all its services. I’m afraid there is a general trend leading big companies on the Web to dominate not only their competitors but the users as well.

      Chronicle of an announced end is what I perceive of my relationship to Microsoft, and we are undoubtedly many to analyze our near future’s relationship with Microsoft in these terms.

    2. KJW said on May 29, 2016 at 7:44 pm
      Reply

      This is a nice synopsis regarding windows 10. With respect to bullet #4, Windows Media center is a critical functionality for those who have invested in CableCARD tuners and infrastructure. Removing Windows Media Center has alienated a segment of the market. Other forums indicate that many would adopt Windows 10 IF the Media Center functionality were included.

      MS: please include Media Center into Windows 10.

  13. Tim said on May 28, 2016 at 10:56 pm
    Reply

    I recently commented on another article that unless there’s a specific reason not to upgrade to Windows 10 (such as compatibility issues, etc), most people are just putting off the inevitable anyway. Windows 7 has already been out of mainstream support for over a year now and will come out of extended support in just over 3.5 years.

    However, I do get the line from the article that “Microsoft does not honour user choice”. That’s the biggest problem, as people should be able to choose what they do or don’t do with their own computers, after all it’s their computer, their property, not Microsoft’s. Who knows, maybe some people are even Windows Media Centre users for example, which Microsoft will remove if they upgrade. Surely they must realise that trying to force (or trick) people against their wishes will only create resentment towards Microsoft, even if people are only putting off the inevitable.

    One thing I find puzzling though is people such as Steve Gibson are anti-Windows 10, but yet champion IOS, which is worse. And don’t get me started on Google tracking.

    1. Dave said on May 28, 2016 at 11:42 pm
      Reply

      The thing you’ve missed, Tim, is that people are putting off the update until a time when Windows 10 may be fantastic. It is quite possible that all the problems people have with Windows 10 will be gone by 2020.

    2. T J said on May 29, 2016 at 3:33 am
      Reply

      And XP is COMPLETELY dead and was buried years ago with full funeral rites. My ar*e.
      How long has XP been out of extended support and is still being used ? :-)
      MS would love to bury everything but Win 10.
      How DARE users ignore the wisdom of the mighty Redmond Behemoth (as chronicled by Ed Bott). :-P

    3. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 9:26 am
      Reply

      There’s nothing inevitable about having to upgrade to Windows 10, that would be like saying it’s inevitable that a kleptomaniac is going to steal something from you so you may as well just give them all your belongings.

      Everyone that upgrades to Windows 10 is sending the message to Microsoft that they’re happy with the direction Windows is heading, you only have to look at how quickly they done a U-turn with Windows 8 to see how low adoption rates forced them withdraw from forcing a mobile phone GUI into Windows, so while you can avoid the worst parts of Windows 10 that’s at best a temporary solution, just like keeping a kleptomaniac away from your belongings is a temporary solution.

      A better solution is to either get the kleptomaniac to change their ways or switch to a friend that doesn’t steal things, a better solution to Windows 10 is either to reject everything it stands for and hope Microsoft changes its ways or to switch to an Operating System that doesn’t contain the worst parts of Windows 10.

      It’s the old adage of voting with your wallet/feet, if you don’t express your opinion through your actions then you’ll just get more of the same.

    4. Jeff-FL said on May 29, 2016 at 3:37 pm
      Reply

      @Tim, inevitable for you, perhaps. I’ll run windows 7 till the wheels fall off, then move to Linux.

  14. Tony said on May 28, 2016 at 11:01 pm
    Reply

    Dear Microsoft: We would like to use Windows 10. But none of us are going to do it until you add clear options to turn off ALL telemetry, data collection, marketing, and advertising. Then you’ll have to honor those options, which you seem to have difficulty doing in your other operating systems, as this article discusses.

    Bottom line, Microsoft, demonstrate to us you can act responsibly and we will let you profit financially. Show us you can’t be trusted, and watch your competition flourish instead.

    1. seeprime said on May 29, 2016 at 12:55 am
      Reply

      Only the Enterprise edition lets you have full control. Knowing Microsoft, thaey might offer an upgrade path from home to Enterprise (not previously possible for Home or Pro) for ~$200. Are you willing to pay Microsoft for privacy? I’m sure that wouldn’t be extortion, since you can opt to keep your current version of Windows 10.

      Just speculating.

      Chromebooks are looking better all the time.

      1. Tony said on May 29, 2016 at 4:06 am
        Reply

        Sure, I would be happy to pay Microsoft a *reasonable* amount for privacy. It just has to be less than the cost of linux, which does not spy on you.

  15. Guinea Pig said on May 28, 2016 at 11:15 pm
    Reply

    Sorry, but for how long are we going to discuss this topic ? We know the pros and cons of Win10 and we know the attitude of MS towards. It’s either accepting it or departing from it. I for myself will try to to find something else as I do not appreciate the way MS was and is handling this matter.
    I also realize it won’t be easy because I am used to and trained like a guinea pig to use Windows. Time will tell.

    1. seeprime said on May 29, 2016 at 8:44 am
      Reply

      The length of time that the issues around Windows 10 have been, and are being, discussed are an indication of the growing resentment toward Microsoft that will result in Windows being used less and less. How far it goes depends on how much longer Microsoft treats consumers like serfs.

      1. No Miles Mathis said on May 29, 2016 at 4:39 pm
        Reply

        The more, the better… alternatives should be listed too.

  16. Microceph 10 said on May 28, 2016 at 11:23 pm
    Reply

    Vice News had a great interview with Edward Snowden. Quite a few examples of how there is a technological global police state being created, and Microsoft, Apple, Google, and the phone companies are right in the middle of it. “Turnkey Tyranny”.

  17. RN said on May 28, 2016 at 11:41 pm
    Reply

    How about running Windows 7 in a Virtualbox VM, making snapshots, and reverting in case Windows 10 somehow sneaks through?

  18. Earl said on May 28, 2016 at 11:57 pm
    Reply

    The only group being really alienated by Win10 consists of Windows users who weren’t already alienated by Microsoft. These were probably Microsoft’s most important group of customers/users. As you say: malware tactics… won’t convince users to do that which they don’t want to do. We paid for something, and we expect to keep using it until we decide otherwise.

    I’ve been using a Chromebook for a couple years but only sporadically for specific things. Now I’m using a new chromebox for all of my basic browsing (and streaming). Microsoft, Mozilla, and Roku have all lost favor with me for various bad behavior and bad updates. I’ll also start using a more traditional Linux again. So, dropping Microsoft will certainly help simplify my computer usage.

    The only companies I want to do business with less are Comcast and Verizon. They’re on their way out, too.

  19. Andy said on May 29, 2016 at 12:35 am
    Reply

    These articles are just stupid like the few people complaining. The upgrade panel clearly tells you to click HERE if you don’t want the upgrade. It does not say click the X click the word THE click the windows key, it says click HERE if you do anything else your stupid. Also to not upgrade turns your computer into another dirty typhoid mary computer on the net, thanks for that, that makes you doubly stupid. At what point in your life did you become bogged in a operating system? Perhaps you should revert to DOS.

    1. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 9:40 am
      Reply

      The upgrade panel contravenes Microsoft’s own guidelines on how to design dialog boxes.
      https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/dn742499%28v=vs.85%29.aspx
      “The Close button on the title bar should have the same effect as the Cancel or Close button within the dialog box. Never give it the same effect as OK. ”

      And it goes against Microsoft’s own advise on How to prevent and remove viruses and other malware.
      https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/129972
      “Never click “Agree” or “OK” to close a window that you suspect might be spyware. Instead, click the red “x” in the corner of the window or press Alt + F4 on your keyboard to close a window.”

      So do tell me why the upgrade panel should be an exception, could it be Microsoft using social engineering techniques, something that’s common place with malware, to trick people into upgrading?

    2. T J said on May 29, 2016 at 1:17 pm
      Reply

      @Andy

      If HERE was capitalised and RED, it would make it easier for people to see.
      Mind you, I suppose you are one of those people who has never forgotten to untick boxes in an install GUI and has never ended up with PUPs or other malware installed. ????

      Reference your “Typhoid Mary” comment, she did not display any virus symptoms unlike Win 10 and did not DELIBERATELY infect other people. MS is deliberately trying to infect PCs/Laptops with Win 10.

      Currently I have 201 KBs hidden. These include:
      13 IE security update (i don’t use IE)
      4 Windows malicious software removal tools.
      17 security updates for Microsoft.NET Framework which will NOT install. No fix found on the Internet,
      12 time zone or language fixes which are irrelevant.
      31 Windows 7 “ease the upgrade to Win 10” KBs. Backdoors for Win 10 auto updates.
      50 (approximately) multi user local network fixes. Irrelevant as I use a stand alone Laptop.

      The other 74 KBs are to fix problems with Windows interaction with software I do not use (Office, Excel, etc).

      I also have 256 KBs installed which ARE relevant to my Laptop security.

      I use the PRO versions of Malwarebytes Anti-Malware, Malwarebytes Anti-Exploit, Emsisoft Internet Security and Cryptoprevent. I have never had any malware or PUPs sneak on to my Laptop.
      So I am stupid not to install Win 10. I am using the OS I prefer (Win 7). Nice and simple. No Dumb Arse “Metro” apps, Live Tiles or links to Candy Crush Saga cluttering up my Home Page.

      Enjoy having having a deep and meaningful relationship with Cortana while she / it steals your personal information.

      PS Your punctuation is appalling and your repeated use of the word “stupid” shows a distinct lack of vocabulary.

      1. T J said on May 29, 2016 at 2:07 pm
        Reply

        Update to my last post.

        39 of the 74 KBs I mentioned are prefaced in MS Support with “If an attacker logs on to your machine and installs…..”.
        They cannot because I have a 15 character alphanumeric password including upper and lower case alpha characters.
        Believe it or not, I do not need a password manager to remember it. :-)

    3. No Miles Mathis said on May 29, 2016 at 4:41 pm
      Reply

      Andy, at least review your post: it’s barely readable.

    4. Janeway said on August 24, 2016 at 1:15 pm
      Reply

      DOS was a great OS it kept 90% of the no nothings off computers. Most of the people saying how great Win 10 is seem to think the horrible un-user friendly GUI is the OS, it’s not. I feel sorry for those people compelled to praise such a bad product just because its the newest or supposed to be the best! The same kind of people were saying the same things about how great Windows ME is and quit using win 98se. As far as thinking MS is making us safer with a more secure OS more secure than what the last OS? That sure makes me feel safe!

  20. swamper said on May 29, 2016 at 12:35 am
    Reply

    Out of 5 PC’s that belong to members of my family that didn’t have 10 yet, 4 of those PC’s had constant Win 10 upgrade prompts. The one that didn’t was old enough that all the drivers on the system had not been ported to 10 by the OEM. One other that got the upgrade prompts was a laptop that did not have the bluetooth driver ported to 10 it however had to be told to upgrade to 10.

    The other 3 PC’s got 10 forced on them. They all ran Win 8.1 and they were all less than 2 yrs old and all the drivers had been ported. By forced on them I mean they left their PC on over night and woke up to 10 on their desktop. They DID NOT select the 10 upgrade, it did it on it’s own.

    None of those PC’s belonged to me personally except the laptop that had to be told to upgrade. I left it on for days after the last round of updates came out trying to get it to upgrade by itself, to see if I could get it to do the same as the PC’s that got forced.. It did not. It didn’t fit what I suspect is a driver profile in the installer and telemetry that MS is taking off everyone’s PC’s because of the bluetooth driver of all things.

    Of the three PC’s that got forced…. 2 of those had GWX Control Panel installed. One of the updates in the last round got by GWX Control Panel and 10 installed itself without being told to.

    I had a whole pile of family and friends bombarding me after this last round of updates. My machine has Win 7 on it and I built it myself about 6 yrs ago. Most of the drivers in it have been ported to 10 but several key drivers have not. I do not get bombarded with 10 offers on it but I keep Win Update locked down and I sort my updates before I install them.

    So to anybody that thinks it’s just real simple to keep 10 off your box.. I got some hostile people that will tell you it’s not.

    The whole point of this little rant is. Your spending time trying to stop something being forced on you that you don’t want and even then your efforts may not do you any good. That time that your spending could actually be used for using your PC not barricading it…

    That doesn’t take a genius for sure.

    My day to day OS is a Linux by the way. I don’t put up with this crap at all except from getting an earful from people I know. Bad part is.., It appears to be a good OS headed in the right direction compared to 8/8.1. The tactics being deployed are where my entire issue lies. I may be MS free when my 7 hits EoL. The aforementioned laptop belongs to the wife. MS will never get another dime of my money, period.

    Nothing stopping them from doing this again(or worse) since they have already set precedent. All of it’s over trying to make money on ads, search, and AI like Google is, tsk, tsk, tsk….. Could have, should have, been done in an entirely different way.

  21. Rowan said on May 29, 2016 at 2:42 am
    Reply

    Martin,

    Thanks for the great blog you write. I check it out daily and have learnt a lot from what you’ve written.

    Slightly off topic, but… I do have a question that I wondered whether you or others could possibly answer:

    I am hesitant about upgrading to Win 10 but don’t want to miss out on the opportunity. Money is still money. If I do so, I will use the technique you published in your blog about doing a clean install by generating and transferring the GeniuneTicket file (dated 30 August, 2015), so that I don’t transfer the ‘baggage’ from my Windows 7 drive.

    I run Win 7 Pro on a reasonably good performing PC which currently does work fine but has a range of software on it – some a little old and may not necessarily cope under Win 10. If I install a second HDD for installing Win 10 and MS transfers the licence over to the Win 10 install, what happens to the HDD with my Win 7 install on it? Does the licence get ‘deactivated’? Can it still be booted from and run, and can I still install Windows updates on it after that? Am I likely to be ever able to reinstall it on this same PC after the 30 days is up. I don’t want a dual bootable drive but it would be good to maintain some of my old legacy software on the Win 7 drive.

    Would I be better to run Oracle VM Virtual Box on the Win 10 HDD and install my Win 7 Pro in that – if MS will still let me ‘activate’ it? Do you think something happens with the licence on the original drive after the 30 days is up?

    Has anyone else done this at all? Your comments, please.

    1. Martin Brinkmann said on May 29, 2016 at 8:16 am
      Reply

      Probably the best option right now is to make a full system backup, run the upgrade to Windows 10, then restore the backup. This way you get the license for Windows 10, but can continue to use Windows 7 for the time being.

      You can then install W10 at any time using an ISO image on the same device, and it should activate automatically unless you made significant changes to the system.

  22. Jonathan said on May 29, 2016 at 2:52 am
    Reply

    My God there are some ignorant comments here, especially regards the so called ‘privacy concerns’. Some of you seriously need to take off the tinfoil hats and read (and actually understand) an Ed Bott article or two, he seems to be the only one not looking for click-bait articles on the matter.

    But hey, if you’re that concerned, then you better stop using Google or any other companies services in this day and age.

    1. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 10:01 am
      Reply

      For real? You seriously think articles on ZDNET and particularly Mr Bott are impartial and not click-bait?

      ZDNET is swamped with advertising from Microsoft and pro Microsoft articles from ex Microsoft employees, you couldn’t find a more pro Microsoft site if you tried.

      And don’t get me start on that fool Ed (Mr Microsoft) Bott, the so called evidence he presents to people is nothing of the sorts and normally taken directly from Microsoft’s own documents, and lets not get started on how Ed (Mr Microsoft) Bott benefits directly from Microsoft’s success with his 25 book all about Microsoft that have been published by Microsoft themselves, Mr Bott is nothing more than an extension of Microsoft’s PR & Marketing departments.

      1. Gary D said on May 29, 2016 at 1:34 pm
        Reply

        @ Jonathan

        I knew that some cretin would call the non Win 10 devotees ” Tin foil Hat Wearers”.
        Do you REALLY believe everything that Ed Bott, the highest paid MS shill, prints ?
        I have read quite a few Bott articles and I REALLY DID understand his rambling dissertations on MS. However, I gleaned no useful information. They are full of generalisations and regular attacks on other writers with alternative views.
        ZDNET is chock-a-block with click-bait articles, especially those which adulate MS.

    2. No Miles Mathis said on May 29, 2016 at 4:46 pm
      Reply

      Thank you for pasting a CIA cubicle piece of propaganda here. Your efforts are appreciated, Jonathan.

    3. Testuser said on May 30, 2016 at 9:57 pm
      Reply

      @Jonathan Sorry, but I stopped reading after seeing “tinfoil hats”. That’s just low level

    4. Janeway said on August 24, 2016 at 1:57 pm
      Reply

      “My God there are some ignorant comments here” like these I guess? “so called privacy concerns” “tinfoil hats” and the best one “understand an Ed Bott article or two” LOL Ed Bott! He can’t be serious can he? His opinions (that he tries to pass as facts) have been wrong so many times for so long! Back in the day (I’m old) we read Ed’s articles in magazines just to see how deluded he was that month! We’d laugh so hard. John Dvorak was funny too, but if you actually liked them you probably like Windows Media Player, Xbox 360, or even (ugh) ITunes!

  23. Bonnie said on May 29, 2016 at 6:47 am
    Reply

    Windows 10 is a VIRUS that downloads whether you want it or NOT.
    Windows 10 is a computer virus! I do NOT want Windows 10 as it will keep mu business applications from working properly. I reject Windows 10 every time, but the WORST is that it DOWNLOADS as an AUTOMATIC UPDATE every time I turn the computer off. I am so sick of THIS HORRID COMPUTER VIRUS called Windows 10.

    I need Windows 7 for my business. When I turn on the computer, I have to wait FOREVER due to REJECTING the Windows 10 VIRUS that keeps downloading onto my computer!

    I wish it had not taken over my tablet – but then that’s what Microsoft wants. They crapped me out of being able to have MS OFFICE on my tablet by downloading their VIRUS of Windows 10 onto it, the it keeps POPPING up to say I can TRY MS OFFICE for a MONTH. Well, it came FREE for a year with my TABLET – & the Windows 10 thing I NEVER wanted STOLE THAT FROM ME.

    I very much believe that the Windows 10 VIRUS has taken over the United States, if not the WORLD! I think it is a SHAME that MOCROSOFT released this Windows 10 VIRUS onto the world & the INTERNET. They should be OUTLAWED from these unethical business practices & sent to jail.

    Leave me alone – I do not want Windows 10.
    I miss the ONLY good version ever made, the only to work RIGHT – Windows XP!
    I keep it on the computer that is OFFLINE; I wish I could have it ONLINE still.

    MICROSOFT has released this COMPUTER VIRUS called Windows 10, & they should be held legally responsible for their VIRUS messing up so many computers!

    Bonnie

    1. hirobo2 said on May 29, 2016 at 7:30 pm
      Reply

      I’m still using XP as my main OS dual-booting it along with Win7!

      What is the reason for keeping XP offline? As long as you avoid IE for some other browser like FireFox, and keep a good current antivirus, it will never catch malware while on the net. I haven’t caught one in the last 6 months being online on XP…

      1. furuhata said on May 29, 2016 at 10:48 pm
        Reply

        Exactly I’m keeping XP as my main OS too, haven’t had any trouble over all those years using it. I use Comodo Firewall to keep tight control over what happens on MY machine, nothing that’ll ever happen to my green grass and clear blue sky.
        On the other hand, seems like a good idea to keep those 7 and 8 machines OFFLINE until you finally find out how to disable your automatic upfreights as reading from this article it seems youre almost GUARANTEED to ‘catch’ some MALWARE on those. This malware (W10) in turn will keep downloading a constant stream of neverending everlasting spyware, adware, viruses that will keep re-arranging how you set things up, removing features, and push continued enhancements to your ad-viewing experience. There won’t be a day where your computer will work the same as yesterday and you will be powerless to do anything. So defend yourself while you still can!

  24. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 10:16 am
    Reply

    To answer Martins question “Is Microsoft doing itself a favor here”
    I would say it is, from a business point of view the benefits far outweigh the negatives, yes they may lose 10% (guessing) or so of the desktop market but when you consider that 10% doesn’t bring in much revenue and the possible revenue streams that come from the other 90% the maths are simple, Microsoft is perfectly happy to cut lose on some users so it can increase the per user revenue on those that remain.

    When you consider a Volume Licensing deal with Microsoft would see a business paying around £50 per year, per user, and that people buying a copy of Windows through normal channels only pay around £10 per year (based on a 10 year life cycle) you soon see retail and OEM sales aren’t earning Microsoft sufficient money.

  25. Jeff said on May 29, 2016 at 11:57 am
    Reply

    I got alienated several times – by Vista, by Windows 8 and Windows 10. Windows 10 is by far the worst attempt to take over decisions that I should have the right to take. Windows 7 is a tolerable improvement over XP but I still need Classic Shell, 7+ Taskbar Tweaker, Media Player Classic, VistaSwitcher, Everything Search, FileSearchEX to make Windows 7 work the way I want.

    Since none of the other Windows releases allow me to work the way I want, I will ignore them. I moved to Windows 7 even as Microsoft forcibly obsoleted XP because they were enough improvements and with third party apps I could reasonably make the computer system *work the way I want*. I cannot stress how important this is! You must have the freedom to work the way you want.

    If Microsoft made something possible once in the past, I applaud that. I gave them money for that. Now if they want to take it away for no good reason, nobody’s going to bother “upgrading” to the inferior OS that took away what you could easily do earlier. The newer crap just doesn’t have that much value and their justification is not good enough either about why they changed it for the worse.

    If Microsoft tries to forcibly take away Windows 7, which I guess they WILL do after 2020 or earlier, I will switch to another OS (Mac OS X) and accept whatever compromises or disadvantages it has over Windows. But I will not, I repeat, NOT move to Windows 10 because it does not allow me to work the way I want FOR NO GOOD REASON AT ALL other than they making changes on a whim.

    In fact, one of the best advantages of Mac OS is that it won’t radically force bad changes on me – at least I hope so since Apple doesn’t do the kind of drastic changes in software that Microsoft does. That’s a big plus point. I gave Linux Mint a try but it was not user-friendly enough for me so I switched back to Windows 7 for now.

  26. Old Guy said on May 29, 2016 at 12:20 pm
    Reply

    OMG,

    windows 10 blah blah blah, etc… I admit M$ was aggressive. My take after 25 years of windoze is, if you actually freaking run windows 10 pro group policy editor (admin rights windows icon+r gpedit.msc) you can turn off like 99% of all the telemetry and make all the apps and store stop. After wasting a good 2 hours of time you will end up with windows 7 pro about 30% faster on the average. Sure you can vilify m$ for forcing people to win 10, but if you actually take the time to turn off all the crap and run the group policy editor it is in fact a better (from a hardware usage and performance standpoint) OS than 7 pro or 8 or 8.1 in my opinion. Now if you are running the home version, the privacy thing is an issue, but no more than the smart phone you are constantly using. But OMG the drama of win 10 is ridiculous, you do not have any privacy any more, duh. If you do not like it, go back to writing letters hand delivered.

    1. flyli5411 said on May 29, 2016 at 1:20 pm
      Reply

      OLD GUY
      HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
      BEAUTIFUL MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY
      HAVE YOU SEEN SUCH A CRISIS IN YOUR LIFE AS WINDOWS 10
      HAAAAAAAA
      BEEN RUNNING 10 FOR MONTHS NOW OMG
      HAAAAAAAA

      1. T J said on May 29, 2016 at 1:46 pm
        Reply

        @ flyli5411

        Are you another idiot who does not know how to turn off shift lock and who holds down individual keys too long so that they multi-repeat? E.G. aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

        WTF is HAAAAAAAAAA supposed to mean. Is it the sort of thing you write, personally, on Twitter or Facebook ?

        N.B. Learn how to PUNCTUATE.

      2. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 1:49 pm
        Reply

        @flyli5411, Is your prolific use of capitals and the repetition of letters something you know you’re doing?
        I only ask as maybe it’s some peculiarity to Windows 10, does it prevent the use of lower case letters and are sticky keys playing up? Or is it just a reflection on the general mentality of people who use Windows 10?

    2. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 1:46 pm
      Reply

      Not sure where you’re getting the 30% faster from as every benchmark I’ve seen shows Windows 10 performs the same as Windows 7, sometimes Windows 10 beats 7 by a small amount and other times 7 beats 10, either way i think your claim that Windows 10 is 30% faster is nothing but hyperbole.

      Also comparing the privacy implications of using a smart phone with those of using a desktop kind of shows you have the same fundamental misunderstanding of how and for what those devices are used for, last time i checked government, police, health, financial, and legal services don’t use smart phones in their dealings with you, and if they did i wouldn’t trust that their IT department has carried out the necessary group policy or other restrictions to prevent *my* data from ended up in the hands of people who have no rights to it.

    3. Jeff said on May 30, 2016 at 7:08 am
      Reply

      You seem to take stupid to the next level. Windows 10’s issues are not all about privacy but about removed features and shoddy user interface that omits tons of stuff behind that Windows 7 had. But yes, data collection and sending it to Microsoft requires processing power and bandwidth too.

  27. Old Guy said on May 29, 2016 at 1:50 pm
    Reply

    flyli5411 you actually get it, unlike the other 99%, oh and you listened.

    1. T J said on May 29, 2016 at 2:22 pm
      Reply

      @ Old Guy

      I recommend that you read Corky’s posts for this and other articles written by Martin Brinkmann about Win 10.

      You never know, you might actually understand what can and, more importantly, cannot be done to turn off Win 10 telemetry, forced updates, live tiles, etc.
      If you do turn them off, the next Win 10 “upgrade / update/ rewrite” turns them back on.
      It is 99% impossible for Win 10 Home users to turn off these “features”.
      Ah well, stick with your delusions about the wonders of Win 10 Beta.

    2. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 3:30 pm
      Reply

      @Old Guy, So you’re saying you and flyli5411 are in the 1% and that it’s the other 99% who don’t get it?
      Because is so that would make you and flyli5411 the abnormal ones and everyone else normal, either way whose normal probably doesn’t matter as much as discussing these claims you’ve made, something I’ve noticed you’ve failed to do.

  28. CHEF-KOCH said on May 29, 2016 at 1:57 pm
    Reply

    A lot of people without any proof that Windows 10 is really that bad. Mostly they grabbing articles they not understand or which are useless because Windows gets more and more faster updates and in meantimes a lot have changed.

    Instead of whining how about to upload whireshark/burp log and show us what MS is ‘according’ to you automatically doing. I think background stuff like OCSP is more as okay, even your browser doing this to check your certificates, there is nothing someone could proof that this is bad.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_Certificate_Status_Protocol

    Of course it’s only one example of many which shows that ‘background’ communication is not always bad, it would brother only users. Same like other mechanism, I think here lies the problem, you can’t build something which collects something without to interrupt the user and then people complaining because it may sends 10 kb in the background which was original designed to maybe secure stuff.

    The opt-out switches are also mostly present via gpedit or directly in the setup. Of course it requires that the user understand and reads it. But never make the mistake to say it’s spying without anything.

    1. T J said on May 29, 2016 at 2:29 pm
      Reply

      @ CHEF-KOCH

      I suggest that you surf the Internet. I GUARANTEE that you will find the necessary proof.
      Search for:
      Win 10 removes hardware drivers.
      Win 10 removes installed software.
      Win 10 does not recognise printers, CAD machines, MRI machines, etc., etc., etc.
      Win10 updates will reset user opt-out switches.

    2. Corky said on May 29, 2016 at 3:47 pm
      Reply

      @CHEF-KOCH, You mean articles like these?
      http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/08/even-when-told-not-to-windows-10-just-cant-stop-talking-to-microsoft/
      https://hackmag.com/security/what-data-windows-10-sends-to-microsoft-and-how-to-make-it-stop/

      Because if so i would be interested in whats changed since then, maybe I’ve missed the announcement from Microsoft where they’ve come clean with what data their gathering.

      As for your repeated reference to Group Policies, while you’re correct in saying a lot can be disabled using that whose to say the next update isn’t going to remove some of those options? It’s not like Microsoft hasn’t set a precedence when they removed the ability for admins to block access to the Windows Store, added to that is why you’d want to use an OS were you have to spend hours, if not days, fighting what amounts to a losing battle.

  29. 420 said on May 29, 2016 at 2:09 pm
    Reply

    ok, I will will hopefully clear this up, windows 10 home version is all about raping you and making money, windows 10 pro is all about omg we need to still sell shit to people that are’nt looking at porn and deciding icecream dates. windows 10 enterprise is all about we need to not fuck up our government contract that makes us ass loads of money. lol

    1. Ted G. said on May 31, 2016 at 5:08 am
      Reply

      Yes – exactly what I thought. I don’t know what all it’s going to do to my laptop that’s on 8.1, but one thing I do know, is that it won’t accept my old Lexmark printer and I don’t know if Win10 even has a “generic” driver (which I was able to do in the past on older machines/systems). I shouldn’t have to be forced to buy a new printer because of a stupid software update I never asked for or wanted. We recently changed to Win10 at the office & I didn’t notice all that much difference, other than appearance & where things have been relocated to. Another thing I blame on Win10, is the business applications such as the accounting system, the tendering software, word processor, spreadsheet system, Adobe, and sometimes the internet itself, seem to run a bit slower and are certainly choppier then was the case on our old OS. The e-mail system Win10 changed is nothing to brag about either. I had to reload all my contacts manually because it wouldn’t do it automatically. We use Lenovo hardware that’s barely 2 years old & behave much nicer than it does now. Like you said, it’s all about the money.

  30. oz said on May 29, 2016 at 2:26 pm
    Reply

    I’m very happy to see that most Win10 articles get plenty of attention and lots of responses all over the web, as they well should.

    My “scale of trust” for companies that I deal with runs from 1 (for the very worst) up to 10 “for the very best”. Microsoft used to rate from about 7.5 to 8.0 on that scale and they remained in that range for most of the 28 years that I’ve been involved in using some of their products. However, once their glorious, everyone needs it and must have it, even if by brute force, Win10 operating system came about, their rating on my scale of trust has dropped to about 2.0 to 2.5, and it appears likely that it will remain there for some time to come, or perhaps fall even more.

    When and if they should ever decide to return control to end users whom most happen to pay for their computers out of their own pockets, I’ll reevaluate their score on the scale of trust. In the interim, if MS want to retain literally all control over PCs, as it is obvious that is what they want, they can purchase millions of computers and give them away to those that would have them. I’d personally still prefer to build my own and have all control.

    Only some (individual or corporation) with the “numbness of mind” exhibited by Microsoft could ever think that all end users should simply accept their almighty, resistance is futile mandate. FMS

  31. Old Guy said on May 29, 2016 at 2:42 pm
    Reply

    ok fine so install linux, umm which one, and I’m a moron that just came from all that crazy windows 10 debacle. ok son, now you have no freaking idea of what is going on, don’t worry this is linux and I will Love you, lol.

    1. Gary D said on May 29, 2016 at 3:27 pm
      Reply

      Old Guy

      I’m glad that you admit you are a freaking moron. It saves me writing it. :-)

    2. Birmingham said on May 29, 2016 at 3:32 pm
      Reply

      Old Guy, yes, you’re right. Linux is easy. For most average users who just need five icons on a desktop it is much easier than a bloated Windows Store OS with many, many secret options to turn shit off. MS can stand to lose a few users. They should be happy with their 300 million users and stop forcing it on people who want a OS without stupid crap.

  32. Theodor Herzl said on May 29, 2016 at 3:22 pm
    Reply

    Δ It is a small price to pay, people. You will be a part of our greatness, whether you like it or not. We rebuilt Germany after WW2. Same with Japan. We house the greatest technology, as well as the strongest military force on the planet. Your devices run on our hardware. Your devices run our software. We invented Unix, BSD, Linux, Windows, Mac as well as Android. We invented the internet. In the end you WILL be assimilated. Resistance is futile. The light shall guide you. ✡

    1. Gary D said on May 29, 2016 at 3:46 pm
      Reply

      Theodor

      Sorry to rain on your parade BUT:

      Sir Tim Berners-Lee ( British ) invented and implemented the World Wide Web.

      Britain was 90% responsible for rebuilding German Industry (EG Volkswagen).

      Using the world’s strongest military force:
      1.
      could not beat the Viet Cong or North Korea. Technically, you are still at war with North Korea.
      2.
      to annihilate Saddam Hussein allowed Musilm fundamentalists to grow in strength.
      George Dubbya (eh he eh he), aided by his pet arse licker Tony Bliar (sorry Blair), destroyed the only bulwark that kept the lid on Islamism by inventing WMDs in Iraq ( which is NOT pronounced Eye-Raq )

      I could comment on the rest of the claims but maybe on another day.

      1. Theodor Herzl said on May 29, 2016 at 4:13 pm
        Reply

        Gary D

        Sorry to shatter your illusions, but:

        1. World Wide Web is only a small part of the internet, which was, by the way, developed over the course of 30+ years by many individuals, including the scientists of ARPA. (Later known as DARPA)

        2. It is what we want you to think.
        3. It is what we want you to think.
        4. It is what we want you to think.
        5. It is what we want you to think.
        6. It is what we want you to think.
        7. We rule over you, for your ignorance allows it.

        Δ The light shall guide you. ✡

    2. MdN said on May 29, 2016 at 10:48 pm
      Reply

      Linux isn’t American (if that’s where you’re from – I’m guessing you are, but you might be Russian or Israeli or from Vatican or Germany or China). We just made you think it is by adding “x” to the name.

  33. 420 said on May 29, 2016 at 3:32 pm
    Reply

    lol, love it, I only wish german efficiency would replace these idioten , eventually 7-11 und starbooks employees, eventually mit stealth und uber shrepp gebliebenz we will reach full control of, wait, what were we talking about?

  34. oz said on May 29, 2016 at 3:42 pm
    Reply

    @ Old Guy

    Linux Mint and Ubuntu are generally good distros for those new to Linux, but technical oriented users can start pretty much anywhere within the listing of Linux distros if they are eager and willing to put a bit of effort into getting the ball rolling. I personally find pretty much all Linux distros easier to deal with than Windows, but some of the BSD distributions available are extremely good options, too.

    Either way, good luck to you with your chosen Linux, BSD, or your further absorption into the world of windows.

  35. 420 said on May 29, 2016 at 3:50 pm
    Reply

    ok so i have 2 laptops, one is a dell precision m4400 from mid 2009 (june 2010) the other is a dell lattitude e6510 i dunno its got a quad core i7 q740m the point is i have run both this old precision m4400 and this newer lattitude e6510 (nov. 2012) with windows 10 pro and spent the 2 hours removing all the spyware and crap. After you do this, it appears to me about 30% faster on the average, the problem with going to linux after working with computers after 25 years is you are giving up a lot of functionality for ease of use, I.E. a lot of stuff works with windows, and it you want it to work with linux you have to modify it. SO your choice is, have it all your way and run Linux, but be limitied. Or, run windows and be spied on to a certain extent.

  36. 420 said on May 29, 2016 at 4:10 pm
    Reply

    Here is the deal, microsoft, apple, google, do not give a fuck about you or your rights, and you are a moron to think that they do. They have legions of lawyers hell bent on not conforming to your whims. SO. If you are so STUPID to imagine that Microsoft Windows 7 any version is Protecting you from ANYONE spying on you? lol a lot. Windows 10 is GOING to come to a device that can take Windows 10 soon, If you imagine you have some say so about things, that will go away eventually.
    You are the product, what you say, how you act and and what you ultimately do is the sale, you can turn a lot of this shit off in the gpedit.msc, but ultimately you better get used to it or use linux. That is it.

  37. No Miles Mathis said on May 29, 2016 at 4:51 pm
    Reply

    Blazing reply, 420. Got to look at the time… bye!

  38. Jeff said on May 29, 2016 at 5:49 pm
    Reply

    It is a conspiracy by Apple. They paid MS tons of $$$ to piss people off so they would get MacOS computers.

    1. Valrobex said on May 29, 2016 at 8:57 pm
      Reply

      @ Jeff,

      I’ll be damned, you just hit the nail on the head!

      Your cogent observation makes so much sense. Thanks for the insight…and the smile. :+)

  39. MAGA said on May 29, 2016 at 5:53 pm
    Reply

    I can’t see MS ever ending the free offer. What I mean is; they’ll leave some kind of path to “upgrade” for the forseeable future. I don’t think they have an alternative. I can’t imagine anyone with a modicum of tech-savvyness ever wanting to pay for 10. Of course, new pc’s will ship with 10, but sales of those are hardly on fire…

  40. insanelyapple said on May 29, 2016 at 7:41 pm
    Reply

    The OS itself is in far better shape if we’re talking about GUI integrity and unification, the main and real problem is how Microsoft acts in field of users/customers privacy and limits our ability to control OS.

    There’s no way to truly leave “telemetry” data gathering, no way to control update settings in basic version of 10 (I am supposed to buy myself that control with Enterprise edition? That’s the idea here Microsoft?) or Windows Defender, not mention that Search component sucks and uploads to their servers every phrase typed – even for local files. And of course the other main charge: the way the upgrade is “passionately” forced on older versions of Windows with gwx.exe component – by poorly described updates, by updates that are returning once were dismissed and mistakenly installed while user couldn’t notice the change, the “mistakenly” issued updates and reverted ones that nobody knows what these had done to the OS.

    If I would go full nuts and look for a second through the glasses that conspiracy theorists wore, I would tell that MS acts on the behalf of and along with the US gov’t security agencies who wants to lie Big Brother gaze over our shoulders by getting every piece of data ordinary people produce all over the world in kind of digital slavery.

  41. Jozsef said on May 29, 2016 at 8:43 pm
    Reply

    Whatever changes or improvements might be made to Windows 10 going forward, the main issue now is the trust that Microsoft has shattered by behaving like a contemptuous, deceitful, adversarial; behemoth. Win OS has changed from a tool to a wily entity that needs to be constantly monitored to keep it in check as it tries to impose its will on the user by stealth and trickery.

    While live tiles may occasionally have their place, by and large they, along with ads, create a constantly shifting landscape that precludes learning the interface fully and using it efficiently and without conscious effort. Put that together with dumbed down apps and loss of configuration options and we have a ridiculous paradox of less usability and more struggle all around. It makes the pain of switching to Linux a lot more palatable and the personal satisfaction of having an OS designed to win the hearts and minds of users in place of the take it or leave it attitude of MS is a very nice change.

    In the end, I’m not sure that people objecting to any of what they’ve done even matter to Microsoft. I think they have a smug sense of superiority and enjoy believing that they’re milking a vast herd of passively acquiescent sheep, if you’ll pardon the mixed metaphor. ;)

  42. pHROZEN gHOST said on May 29, 2016 at 9:10 pm
    Reply

    Microsoft has always alienated some of its users. They have just perfected the process with Windows 10.

    Just be glad they have not made previous versions of Windows drop dead. Oops. I hope MS does not read this blog.

  43. Concerned said on May 29, 2016 at 9:37 pm
    Reply

    Martin, please watch out. Although I appreciate the multitude of opinions I can find here it becomes painfully obvious that some of the comments have only an infamous purpose: insulting and badmouthing other peoples views. This forum does not need these trolls and in the long run they may damage the reputation of your site.

    1. Martin Brinkmann said on May 30, 2016 at 7:38 am
      Reply

      If you find any that you think are out of line let me know and I take a look in case I missed them.

  44. Concerned NOT said on May 29, 2016 at 11:06 pm
    Reply

    Most of the posts carry names that are known to me (I read most comments).

  45. 420 said on May 30, 2016 at 12:37 am
    Reply

    so I almost shudder at this 20 year anniversary build, I mean I’m almost happy with the way things are working, yet M$ thinks it knows my brain better than I do. Wait what were we talking about, oh yes I remember now, Good News Everyone.

    LULZ

  46. ben said on May 30, 2016 at 4:40 am
    Reply

    I ran Never10 and it’s been great so far.. no nagging update/icons!

    I don’t have an issue with Windows10, but I’ve had issues with Window updates in the past where I’ve had to do a restore to get back to where it boots.. so if there’s even a .001% chance that I have to invest my time to fix something caused by updating, it’s not worth it. I know I’m missing out on possibly more annoying charm bars.

  47. b said on May 30, 2016 at 10:02 am
    Reply

    according to Reuter.com, may 26: “Microsoft Corp and Facebook Inc have agreed to jointly build a subsea cable across the Atlantic Ocean to meet growing demand for high-speed cloud and online services.”
    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-microsoft-facebook-cable-idUSKCN0YH26Q

    yet another reason to dump windows, in my opinion

  48. Ravi said on May 30, 2016 at 10:16 am
    Reply

    This Win 10 is really getting on my nerves.
    1. My fingerprint reader stopped working and no one has drivers for it.
    2. My Bluetooth and WiFi stopped and no driver
    3. That “Windows Security Service stopped working” slide out is so f^^^ing irritating.

    1. DVDRambo said on May 30, 2016 at 2:54 pm
      Reply

      Download the driver that was used for the previous version of Windows (7 or 8.1). Right click on it and open the tab for compatibility mode. Select you last version and run as administrator. Now you can install it. I’ve not seen this not work on Windows 10. In fact, I installed a Vista/7 GeForce video driver on an 7 year old machine after installing Windows 10. W10 kept on going to the default Microsoft Basic Driver, that would not go up to 1920 x 1080. Windows 10 can be quite flexible when installing drivers. The issue as I see it is that two years ago at a seminar for partners, an MS rep told us that older drivers would be automatically chosen and installed. That never happened and likely never will. So, you have to do it for your self or find someone that can do it correctly.

      1. Gary D said on May 30, 2016 at 5:10 pm
        Reply

        @DVDRambo

        Your post has given me some very useful information about porting drivers. Thanks for the input. :-)

  49. LD said on May 31, 2016 at 12:06 am
    Reply

    I come from an Enterprise user background. Being in IT Planning for over 30 years I have dealt with migration planning, OS test plans, new hardware acquisitions, app testing and employee training and support planning. It is a massive undertaking for a large Enterprise with 100,000 plus employees. It is disruptive, costly and stressful. Experienced IT Pros and strategic planners are aware of the life cycle of every OS, so plans and budgets are in place well in advance of the inevitable. You get to know your suppliers, their strategy and their products and services.

    Microsoft suddenly changed their business model, started experimenting with services and service delivery, became an OEM themselves and built an OS that will evolve forever (whatever that really means). The Enterprise got hit with the equivalent of a giant tsunami. Media reports say everything is hunkydory and testing is underway for W10.. Negotiated agreements have led to Enterprises being able to control the OS as they prefer and migrations to W10 will begin in 2017. The appearance is that the Enterprise clients have not be alienated at all.

    IT Pros are seething on a number of issues and there is nowhere else to go – MACs are not an alternative for the entire corporation (within a large corporation there are some research areas that use UNIX and MACs but they are small departments). There are way too many unknowns that used to be knowns. We are sick of being trained seals.

  50. A41202813GMAIL said on June 1, 2016 at 6:10 pm
    Reply

    pos company.

    XPOCALYPSE FOREVER !

  51. Corky said on June 1, 2016 at 6:34 pm
    Reply

    Just when people think Microsoft can’t get anymore devious they remove the option to avoid the upgrade altogether.
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/06/01/windows_10_nagware_no_way_out/

    1. Martin Brinkmann said on June 1, 2016 at 6:46 pm
      Reply

      With a screenshot of my site in the background, how fitting ;)

  52. A different Martin said on June 1, 2016 at 11:44 pm
    Reply

    It looks like Microsoft has started extending the GWX program to Windows Enterprise.

    My dad has two laptops running Windows 7 Enterprise. The desktop computers at his office are centrally administered and maintained by his office’s sysadmins, but employees’ laptops and home-office desktops are not. I’m the routine sysadmin of necessity for his laptops, and up till now it has been a great relief that I didn’t have to worry about Windows-10-related updates being delivered via Windows Update. Microsoft simply didn’t propose them on Windows Enterprise systems. I was even able to continue allowing Windows Update to automatically download and install “Important” updates. (I sometimes go up to a couple of months without seeing my dad, and he can’t be relied on to run Windows Update on his own. He’s subject to HIPAA and it wouldn’t do to allow critical security holes to remain unpatched for very long.)

    Anyway, I was updating his laptops a couple of days ago, and lo and behold, KB 3123862, “Updated capabilities to upgrade Windows 8.1 and Windows 7,” was offered as an optional update. Okay, so it was only optional (for now), but I think it’s the first time I’ve seen a Windows 10 update proposed in Windows 7 Enterprise.* To use the ever-popular stalking and sexual-harassment metaphor, this move strikes me as the GWX equivalent of “just the tip.” I’m telling you, though: if any self-administering Windows 7 Enterprise users follow through and actually upgrade to Windows 10 without first clearing it with their company’s IT department, the company is likely to be as happy as an old-school dad whose teenage daughter comes home from a school trip pregnant. I’ve installed GWX Control Panel on every non-Enterprise Windows 7 system I take care of, and now it looks like I should probably install it on my dad’s Enterprise systems, as well. Let’s call it a “prophylactic” measure.

    *Qualification: I run Internet Explorer only to update the Flash Player ActiveX plugin, and sometimes to update Adobe AIR. It’s possible that the Windows 10 adware that Microsoft bundled with an Internet Explorer security update last April made it onto my dad’s Windows 7 Enterprise computers and that I simply haven’t noticed it.

  53. pcunite said on June 16, 2016 at 8:12 pm
    Reply

    I really like Windows 10 even though I thought Windows 7 was pretty close to optimal. I like 10’s updated Task Manager. The multiple desktop feature might come in handy. I do have FileSearchEX installed to give that file and folder search experience I want. Also, Windows 10 is better with large DPI than previous versions.

  54. Ubeen Hadd said on July 9, 2016 at 9:29 am
    Reply

    I got my first copy of win95 by downloading through usenet.

    I needed a usenet server with enough latency to get all the parts dowloanded to my 386sx running ramdoubler, so I used a bogus credit card number generated by ccnum and validated using porn advertisements from the back of a skin mag, so that I could sign up to use AOL’s usenet server.

    Well, Bill said their only goal at the time was to get us to use it.

    They would figure out how to get us to pay for it later.

    Now that I’m a grownup sysadmin for a large company, we do pay for the software we use – for the most part.

    But the games MS is playing in pushing Win10 makes me feel justified in sliding back into old habits.

    When we were audited recently, I converted one vm host to all opensource rather than paying MS another nickel.

  55. para said on July 29, 2016 at 6:07 pm
    Reply

    What people do not seem to realise, is that MS has been the child of the govt(well their masters) since it’s inception. Gates is now repaying his given opportunites, by being a part of Eugenics.
    Win 10 is just another attempt to evolve the level of non-privicy to the govt and their masters.

    We have to be clear that no matter what we do, they will not listen to us, for they are frightened of something, and that something includes our private thoughts.

    No doubt Win 20 or 30 will include a headset that controls the PC by reading your thoughts. Of course these thoughts are then recorded and sent to somewhere where they will be gathered and analysed.

    Best is to have 2 PCs. One internet bound and the other never having being ever connected to the internet, that is if you want privacy. Otherwise just be aware that “privacy” is going to be a word that is taken from the dictionary in the near future.

    You may even hear your children say one day, “Granddad, i cant believe that people were worried about privacy issues in your day. Why?”

    :)

  56. Gotsjacks said on September 21, 2016 at 1:21 pm
    Reply

    I believe M$ has finally come to a agreement with the N.S.A. . On that little backdoor it needed for Windows to keeps us all safe from those home grown terrorists . On the other hand we can believe M$ out of the goodness of there heart just wanted to give everyone a program worth between $99.00 to $199,00 for free with updates . I have a hard time with that last one ! It’s M$ telling me I just don’t know what is good for me but big brother says they do . So they invade my computer change my settings, take away permissions to access my computer, setup files and folders not even in safe mode as administrator will not let me read these . I will bust up every piece of equipment with Windows I own and buy Apple at any price before I give M$ the satisfaction of screwing me and my computer . I say class action law suit for invasion of privacy and intentional destruction of private property they are not the government, homeland security or law enforcement . They have NO right to do this .Now imagine if they collected 100 to 200 kbps from every device running Windows what kind of super computer M$ could conjure !! Just some twisted thoughts I hope ..

  57. Jose said on September 25, 2016 at 5:20 pm
    Reply

    I am with you.
    Class action law suit for invasion of privacy and intentional destruction of private property.
    I am all for it

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