Brave appears to install VPN Services without user consent

Martin Brinkmann
Oct 18, 2023
Updated • Oct 19, 2023
Added Brave statement
Brave
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If you have the Brave Browser installed on your Windows devices, then you may also have Brave VPN services installed on the machine. Brave installs these services without user consent on Windows devices.

Brave Firewall + VPN is an extra service that Brave users may subscribe to for a monthly fee. Launched in mid-2022, it is a cooperation between Brave Software, maker of Brave Browser, and Guardian, the company that operates the VPN and the firewall solution. The firewall and VPN solution is available for $9.99 per month.

Brave Software is not the only browser maker that has integrated a VPN solution in its browser. Mozilla, maker of Firefox, entered into a cooperation with Mullvad and launched Mozilla VPN in 2020.

Update: Brave plans to address the issue in a future release. The VPN service will only be installed after a user purchases the VPN.

The company notes that the VPN services are set to Manual and that they won't start unless started by the user. The services will only run when users purchase Brave VPN.

Furthermore, no data is sent to Brave from the VPN services. End

Brave Browser's installation of VPN services on Windows

A post on Privacy Guides suggests that Brave Browser installs its VPN Service without user consent and regardless of whether the VPN is used or has been used in the past.

You can verify this easily by following these steps:

  1. Use Windows-R to open the Run box.
  2. Type services.msc to open the Services manager on Windows.
  3. Scroll down until you come to the Brave section there.
  4. Check for Brave VPN Service and Brave VPN Wireguard Service.

If they exist, Brave has installed the services on your device. If you were never subscribed to Brave Firewall + VPN, the company may have done so without your consent.

The two services have no description, the startup type Manual and Manual Trigger Start.

There is no explanation why these services got installed on the system. Cautious users may set the two Services to disabled:

  1. Right-click on one of the services and select Properties.
  2. Switch the Startup type from Manual to Disabled.
  3. Repeat the process for the second VPN service.

Deleting the Windows services is another option. The main issue here is that there is no guarantee that a browser update won't install the Services again. You'd need to monitor the services whenever Brave Browser updates to make sure of that.

Some users who replied to the discussion on Privacy Guides said that they did not have these services installed.

Closing Words

Why are the VPN services installed in first place? Brave made no announcement in this regard. Maybe so that users can start using the VPN immediately on Windows and not after a restart.

In any event, you now have the tools at hand to check for the services and either disable or delete them.

Now You: do you use Brave Browser?

Summary
Article Name
Brave is installing VPN Services without user consent
Description
Brave Software appears to be installing VPN services on Windows devices without user consent during Brave Browser updates.
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Ghacks Technology News
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Comments

  1. Yash said on October 22, 2023 at 9:13 am
    Reply

    Sort of thing you’d expect from a company that received funding from Peter Thiel. I’m surprised it took this long for Brave to do this. Anyway this goes in addition to referral codes and other nonsense of Brave browser.

    1. Iron Heart said on October 23, 2023 at 11:56 am
      Reply

      You use a browser funded by literal Google and never complained about it. Just saying.

      1. Anonymous said on October 23, 2023 at 12:10 pm
        Reply

        Your broswer is literal funded by SBF and Facebook execs. Brave does not make it’s funding sources public, so who knows what other companies they are involved with. Although I would be very surprised if they didn’t also have a search engine deal with Google.

        Brave is also supported by Google. No Chromium, no Google Play store, no Brave.

  2. Bravetard said on October 20, 2023 at 1:29 am
    Reply

    Brave is better

  3. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 4:29 pm
    Reply

    the brave fanboys found this page and it shows

    1. Tom Hawack said on October 19, 2023 at 9:15 pm
      Reply

      Ah! fanboys (any fangirls round the corner?), Brave fans, Firefox fans or is it Mozilla fans defined by @Iron Heart as “Mozdrones”? New terminlogy here). I’ll tell you what the best browser is, a browser never mentioned anywhere, a piece of elegant, smart code, fast ‘n’ furious, dedicated to security and privacy, aesthetic, well thought, excellently carried out : the one to come. Do I trigger a consensus on that?

  4. JB said on October 19, 2023 at 8:31 am
    Reply

    Brave VPN is not free, they have no free version, only paid users can use Brave VPN, I wish they would install it in my computer like the post says this way I could have a paid VPN for free.

  5. Tony said on October 19, 2023 at 3:35 am
    Reply

    It also, in my case anyway, installed a wireguard startup process that is separate from the services mentioned in article. Incidentally there was a wireguard VPN icon in the system tray. I never asked for VPN, and even disabled it in flags along with the VPN services, and yet there it was running. Very annoying.

  6. Glork said on October 19, 2023 at 2:39 am
    Reply

    If the service is not started and is not running unless someone buys and opts in to the VPN, and the service is removed when the browser is uninstalled, I fail to see the issue. Ok, the install is slightly more bloated than it would be otherwise. You are running Windows, that ship has sailed. Get a grip.

    I mean Brave is a browser whose business model has historically been hijacking (not simply blocking) web ads, and ya’ll are upset about an extra Windows service being installed? Many, many software packages install services which may not be possible to unbundle or without giving an option to do so.

    1. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 10:01 pm
      Reply

      @Glork seems to be the first to take the trouble to check before firing off a comment! Brave seems to add the services but they are set to manual. Manual services need to be triggered to start. Leave the VPN icon alone in Brave and they do not run.

      I am now guessing someone out there will “be thinking, you cannot trust…”. Keep your conspiracy theories to yourself, please”. We already had enough flack from the first comment.

  7. Paul said on October 19, 2023 at 2:32 am
    Reply

    ironheart v. the rest of the world

    1. michael said on November 29, 2023 at 3:00 am
      Reply

      Was updating my Zipcar account while using the Brave browser while trying to upload my drivers license to my my Zipcar account while trying to validate the DL. The popup refused to let me go until I let Brave download the VPN. I had to do a X out of the browser to release me. VPN’s are only good as the privacy their committed to. The nasty f….ks are not committed to privacy and use THEIR VPN to spy on you and track. Lawsuits will be coming. Only thing these f…ks understand is when they get sued and lose a lot money. Attn: Brave do NOT contact me. Now by law if you contact me you are flucked.?

    2. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 7:29 am
      Reply

      False, large sections of this particular comment section are just Mozilla drones / shills. This has nothing to do with “rest of the world”, lol. gHacks is a bubble par excellence.

    3. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 7:19 am
      Reply

      @Iron Heart pointed out some good arguments, just read them carefully again.

      1. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 5:06 pm
        Reply

        no he did not

  8. ECJ said on October 19, 2023 at 12:28 am
    Reply

    Github issue here:

    Windows should not install VPN services until VPN is purchased/enabled

    https://github.com/brave/brave-browser/issues/33726

  9. Karlston said on October 18, 2023 at 8:17 pm
    Reply

    Kaspersky did this a few years go, people started noticing a new system tray icon. Except as well as installing their VPN offering without the users’ consent, they (of course) also started it running.

    They crossed the line.

    Their support got flayed when people noticed.

  10. TelV said on October 18, 2023 at 5:28 pm
    Reply

    This article which goes by the title: “Choose your browser carefully” is getting a bit old in the tooth now, but may still be relevant. Here’s its link to Brave: https://www.unixsheikh.com/articles/choose-your-browser-carefully.html#brave

    These days I use Floorp which is a Japanese browser from Ablaze. Here’s their Privacy Policy: https://docs.ablaze.one/privacy_policy/ It will probably appear in Japanese, but if you have TWP installed you can read it in your own language: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/traduzir-paginas-web/

    I also use the Wireguard app in combination with Mullvad VPN. Mullvad provides its own app which includes not only Wireguard, but also OpenVPN. I prefer the standalone Wireguard app though.

    I like Floorp because of the additional privacy settings and have been using it ever since ‘owl’ (a user on this forum) brought it to my attention. Definitely worth a look. https://floorp.ablaze.one/download/

  11. ECJ said on October 18, 2023 at 4:16 pm
    Reply

    Looking at the event logs, this service was installed with Brave Stable Version 1.57.47, released on 15 August 2023.

    Time Created:
    15/08/2023 21:59:33

    Message:
    A service was installed in the system.

    Service Name:
    Brave Vpn Wireguard Service (BraveVpnWireguardService)

    Service File Name:
    “C:\Program Files\BraveSoftware\Brave-Browser\Application\116.1.57.47\BraveVpnWireguardService\brave_vpn_wireguard_service.exe”

    Event Id:
    7045

  12. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 3:45 pm
    Reply

    Comments are still misplaced eveywhere randomly, this is madness, just fix this crap!

  13. Herman Cost said on October 18, 2023 at 3:16 pm
    Reply

    I use Brave as a 3rd browser, which means very infrequently. I appreciate Martin’s letting us know about this, and found (to my annoyance) that I do have the Brave VPN installed on my computer. I disabled both tasks and will let the browser be for now. But the lack of transparency does bother me, and if it continues I’ll delete Brave.

    1. matternot said on October 18, 2023 at 3:41 pm
      Reply

      I use Firefox as my main browser and switched from Brave to Thorium for secondary.

      1. penny said on October 19, 2023 at 4:40 am
        Reply

        thorium goat. just switched over from librewolf

  14. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 2:11 pm
    Reply

    Edge vs Brave, both fighting to become the worst overbloated browser.

  15. V. Fromme said on October 18, 2023 at 1:02 pm
    Reply

    Saw the VPN in the settings after the recent upgrade.
    Worried about the VPN? Just delete the files in the Brave directory.
    Problem solved.
    It will most likely get installed agian, but now you have a solution.

    1. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 5:03 pm
      Reply

      The VPN malware got installed again with the latest update. Brave is becoming worse than Firefox.

      1. Tom Hawack said on October 19, 2023 at 9:06 pm
        Reply

        So we go, as in all debates, from one extreme to another, from stating that a browser installing VPN services is not opened to criticism to stating it is malware. It need not be malware to be questionable. For what I understand malware is a new argument and I’d be pleased that you argument this assertion.

  16. bruh said on October 18, 2023 at 12:57 pm
    Reply

    I can see it from both sides, sure – if a browser is filled to the brim with features, it’s reasonable for the browser to have all these tools/services “ready to go” at their disposal, they already do this with lots of different things, just things that aren’t “windows services”, so you don’t notice.

    Personally, adding services to the main windows service list (which I consider to be quite a prestigious place, only things that matter should go there) is a bit dodgy, especially things that are “optional”. Imagine you just use the browser as a browser – Then what, you’ll end up every single optional service installed anyway? Because that was easier than just asking the end user once? That sucks, but it was probably a calculated decision. Software developers (rightfully) assume the average end user to be a drooling moron.

    Although normal, discerning people shouldn’t be mad, because it’s a “manual” service, not a “startup” service – so really it will sit dormant “just in case”.

  17. John said on October 18, 2023 at 12:38 pm
    Reply

    If its a paid service then it should not install by default. But it also should not have anything running in background. Maybe this is more about triggering a future promotion for the VPN service??

  18. 🐷 said on October 18, 2023 at 10:58 am
    Reply

    No, I do not use the Brave browser.

  19. Keith said on October 18, 2023 at 9:28 am
    Reply

    “it needs to be ready to use, either via the Wireguard protocol or via the OpenVPN protocol. As such, these need to start up with the browser so that the VPN service in the browser is ready to use. If those did not start up, the built-in VPN in Brave would be broken.”

    It could do all that AFTER a user has decided to use the VPN service.

  20. tinarse said on October 18, 2023 at 9:26 am
    Reply

    I’ve never liked Brave, so this event just reinforces my opinion of it.

    When I need a Chromium-based browser that doesn’t come with a thick layer of unwanted crapware, I recommend and use unGoogled Chromium. For general use, I use and very much like Firefox ESR.

    And while some aspects of this site may going downhill (like some seemingly chatbot-generated low-quality posts, and the constantly-broken comments), I still view Martin’s and Ashwin’s posts as essential reading.

  21. Hy said on October 18, 2023 at 8:54 am
    Reply

    Thank you, Martin, for bringing this insidious treachery to our attention. I expected better from Brave.

    1. ikomrad said on October 18, 2023 at 2:21 pm
      Reply

      I’ll continue to not install Brave thanks to this news. i used chrome but it’s “better the devil you know.” :)

    2. Tom Hawack said on October 18, 2023 at 1:16 pm
      Reply

      Brave browser was the only alternative to Firefox I had in mind. No longer with these VPN Services installed without user consent, be they activated only with user consent : a browser is not to install anything else than itself and bypassing this obvious rule is to be done, explicitly, only if the user decides to use a feature which requires the installation of external code.

      1. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 1:40 pm
        Reply

        Tom, you actively promote Firefox which installed a background task that actively spied on the user’s default browser and reported it back to Mozilla HQ, starting with Firefox 75.0:

        _https://www.ghacks.net/2020/04/09/mozilla-installs-scheduled-telemetry-task-on-windows-with-firefox-75/_

        Nothing else needs to be said regarding your double standards.

      2. Tom Hawack said on October 18, 2023 at 2:11 pm
        Reply

        @Iron Heart, I have never promoted whatever browser, application, software when only sharing my experience and inherent appreciation of their values or sadness about their mistakes, stated with ‘IMO’ most of the time, almost always accompanied with the reserve that these experiences were mine, without extrapolating to a general, universal truth. I have occasionally shared an enthusiasm irrationally, but never with arguments against alternatives with the exception og Google (GAFAM as a whole) browsers, applications, services. It is not by transferring your own behavior to others that you’ll resolve an endemic approach of people and things when not in conformity with your very personal truths. Think about it. And remember, adding ‘IMO’ relaxes everyone and brings a minimum touch of a civilized comment.

        I’ll be kind to inform you that I’m off this sterile dialog with you for now. Back to serious work.

      3. @ChuckLoman said on October 18, 2023 at 9:54 pm
        Reply

        @Tom Hawack- Dude, why are you feeding this troll? Look at his posts; he added nothing useful to add to Martin’s post, and he seems like he really enjoys arguing and name calling.

      4. Tom Hawack said on October 18, 2023 at 2:21 pm
        Reply

        I forgot to answer about your link to Ghacks’ article “Mozilla installs Scheduled Telemetry Task on Windows with Firefox 75”

        I hadn’t commented that article, maybe had I missed it, though I recall the fact itself. Had i defended Mozilla then? Given I had not commented certainly not and had I commented that I would have disagreed with Mozilla’s decision and would have stated it clearly : I don’t worship anyone nor anything as you do.

        Nothing else needs to be said regarding your obsessional standards.

      5. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 2:36 pm
        Reply

        @Tom Hawack

        You are using a browser which installs background tasks that actually phone home to HQ (which, contrary to this clickbait here, should be called out, except by you apparently) and you promote it any chance you get (just your opinion ofc – not promotion, all covered by the multipurpose “IMO”). Clearly if you are here bashing Brave for background tasks that don’t even connect to any endpoint, this is an obvious, hilarious even, double standard. I am willing to bet that you forgot about the shit Mozilla pulled some time ago (still does), came here to bash Brave, and were caught by surprise when I brought it to your attention again. I have demonstrated what needed to be demonstrated here, have a nice day.

      6. Tom Hawack said on October 18, 2023 at 3:28 pm
        Reply

        @Iron Heart, coffee-break to discover your latest fantasies.

        I do not, have never promoted Firefox unconditionally. I’ve had my words to condemn what I disagreed with.
        Concerning Firefox’ Agent Telemetry initiated with Firefox 75 and reported here on Ghacks with the article you previously mentioned [https://www.ghacks.net/2020/04/09/mozilla-installs-scheduled-telemetry-task-on-windows-with-firefox-75/] which, I repeat, I had not commented, if I had I would of course have condemned it.

        That’s back to April 2020, I found in my archives related data, including :

        [https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/software/firefox-now-tells-mozilla-what-your-default-browser-is-every-day/]

        A personal note :
        “Firefox Default Browser Agent Telemetry – README.txt
        ______________________________________________________________

        Fixed by setting “DisableDefaultBrowserAgent”=dword:00000001 in F:\firefox\config\group-policies.reg”

        I don’t accept Firefox features I disagree with, and not having mentioned at the this disagreement here doesn’t mean I approved it! If I like or dislike and say it, write it, it has always been independently of phantasms, worships, double standards. I even recall having written (in our of our memorable debates) that “I wasn’t maaried with Firefox”.

        I continue to disagree with Firefox’ Browser Agent Telemetry as well as I disagree with Brave’s install of VPN Services should they be inactive. I’ll even add that IMO Brave’s commitment to VPN Services is less problematic than Firefox’s Agent Telemetry. But both practices are to be condemned IMO, even if severity is different : we call that a nuanced approach, if you ever get to understand what nuances, intellectual consistency and coherence ever mean.

        If I was running a browser other than Firefox or Brave, practices of both as above mentioned would certainly not be an incentive. Happens I know Firefox and bypassed their Agent Telemetry. Brave’s install of VPN Services is certainly easily disabled as all Services are (Windows services anyhow) and as such bring the practice to an equivalency to Firefox’ Agent Telemetry : both may be disabled easily.

        I nevertheless consider that I expected more from Brave in the same way I was disappointed with Firefox’ Browser Agent Telemetry. But I run the former and not the latter. I run Firefox and choosing an alternative is really not in favor of a browse which installs a VPN Service with informing the user. That’s all there is to it. I don’t bash, never have.

        Please do try to lift your reasoning to higher levels, be precise, calm, respectful and … nuanced & objective.

        Coffee is cold by now. Have a nice day : disagreeing means not hatred, of course, even if it may include exasperation, not in the face of different opinions but in the face of stubbornness, that which avoids flexibility and prefers radical comments. Be gentle with yourself my dear boy :)

      7. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 4:52 pm
        Reply

        wow Tom Hawack, respect, really respect

      8. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 7:06 pm
        Reply

        @Anonymous

        I respect his smooth talking skills too, he is a master of the art. But Mozdrone is Mozdrone, sadly it will be proven again in the next article.

  22. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 7:49 am
    Reply

    People have genuinely grown stupid and this site has been going downhill fast as well. I’ll point out the obvious: Brave does NOT connect you to their VPN by default, it genuinely can’t either since the VPN itself is paid. You can check “What is my IP address” and you will see that it’s your home IP address at all times. That being said, in case a user wants to use the VPN, it needs to be ready to use, either via the Wireguard protocol or via the OpenVPN protocol. As such, these need to start up with the browser so that the VPN service in the browser is ready to use. If those did not start up, the built-in VPN in Brave would be broken. These local tasks starting up does not mean that any connection to Brave’s VPN service is established, that’s provably not the case.

    Seriously I can’t take the general stupidity anymore, I expected better from you, Martin.

    1. Lee said on October 19, 2023 at 8:58 am
      Reply

      I somewhat agree with @Iron Heart’s statement. They probably registered it to provide a VPN service. If it’s not used, it shouldn’t have a significant impact, which is a valid point. I haven’t verified directly, but when installing Brave, there might have been something in the terms of service indicating the possibility of registering a VPN-related service, and users likely agreed to it.

      However, I can’t agree with the viewpoint that asks, ‘What’s different between Firefox creating a scheduler for telemetry and Brave?’ I’ve read through the article you shared, and it mentions that if users deactivate telemetry, it won’t be generated. Additionally, it only collects prior and current browser configurations and the language and version of the operating system. I think there’s a significant difference compared to a VPN that can view all of a user’s requests and responses (though surely Brave wouldn’t collect them, right…?).

      Based on what I’ve gathered so far, if someone asks, ‘Is Firefox better than Brave in terms of personal data protection?’ I’d say ‘no’. In my opinion, neither is ideal. Both browsers have distinct issues when it comes to extreme privacy concerns.

      But if I had to choose between these two browsers, I’d pick Firefox. I’d supplement its shortcomings using arkenfox’s user.js[1] and its extensions. I don’t want to install services on my computer that I won’t use. Whether it’s Brave Reward, Search, or even VPN, by my standards, Brave just seems like what’s commonly referred to as bloatware.

      [1] https://github.com/arkenfox/user.js

    2. penny said on October 19, 2023 at 4:28 am
      Reply

      can you also explain then why brave search always reverts Anonymous usage metrics back on in their settings? isnt it kind of weird that the other settings stay the way its been set as except this setting? everytime? im not even on the brave browser, but used to use brave search for at least a year and more until recently.

      or why that popular website that compares privacy browsers has no mention that its owned and operated by a brave employee? which ofc shows how better brave is compared to its competition…. ya i dunno man

      1. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 7:44 am
        Reply

        @penny

        Sorry but why are you using Brave Search if you don’t trust its privacy policy? Because in the end, that is all you’ve got, since the backend code running on their servers is not open source. Before you ask, the same is true for DuckDuckGo and StartPage also, they too only give you a privacy policy and you have to trust that what is written there is actually true. It’s like trusting a VPN service, none of those (that I know of) have published their backend code. Instead of this “Trust me, bro” approach you could be using something like a SearXNG instance (which can fetch results from Brave Search, too) where the backend code is actually public. The Brave Browser is open source (and can insofar be monitored, analyzed), Brave Search is not.

        I could now say some words about how smart it is to follow a “Trust me, bro” approach, but then I would be accused again of name calling, which wastes my time for no reason, so I won’t. You can imagine yourself how smart and prudent that is.

      2. penny said on October 20, 2023 at 6:04 am
        Reply

        brother. this website you posted….. the most popular private browser comparison one

        https://privacytests.org/private.html

        is owned and operated by a brave employee…… dont you find it odd they disclose that?
        also check how they test. its interesting that all the conditions just happen to favor brave… i mean it is what it is but you cant deny stuff like this add to their shady nature

    3. penny said on October 19, 2023 at 4:21 am
      Reply

      ? what is you talking about you sound like a brave shill. which isnt surprising there are so many these days.

      1. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 7:36 am
        Reply

        @penny

        > what is you talking about you sound like a brave shill

        No, I just want to know how background tasks that don’t even connect anywhere impact me negatively, and nobody can tell me how. I am really scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of the minimal reasoning I demand of my opponents. But still, nothing. Sad. If that makes me a shill then I’d rather be that then a useless rage baiter under a clickbait article, I am just saying it as it is.

    4. Dan said on October 19, 2023 at 1:24 am
      Reply

      @Iron Heart Anyone with a brain knows that Brave browser is pure SPYWARE. It’s Google chrome with a dumb lion as a logo. People who care about thier privacy would use Firefox, not some trashy crypto-spyware. (Brave)

      1. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 7:34 am
        Reply

        @Dan

        > Anyone with a brain knows that Brave browser is pure SPYWARE.

        Provably not true (not that it matters to you):

        https://privacytests.org/private.html

        https://www.ghacks.net/2020/02/25/study-finds-brave-to-be-the-most-private-browser/

        > People who care about thier privacy would use Firefox

        LOL yeah, the browser with boatloads of telemetry that sends every key press of yours to Google by default, comes with no adblocking, no fingerprinting protection by default, and needs to be “fixed” with various dubious user.js files that actually make you stick out like a sore thumb, ’cause that will prevent tracking. That Firefox? Good luck on your journey.

        > crypto

        Browser needs to be funded somehow unless it can live off others as a search engine leech and pseudo-competitor (Mozilla).

    5. GerryGerryGerry said on October 19, 2023 at 12:19 am
      Reply

      @Ironheart
      If Brave doesn’t install their VPN on my machine, why does it show up in my Startup list??
      Did YOU look in YOUR Startup list??

      1. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 7:47 am
        Reply

        @Gerry

        Have you read my comments? I don’t deny the existence of the background tasks with e.g. the WireGuard protocol, they are strictly necessary too so that the built-in VPN can work at all. The background tasks exist, but don’t connect anywhere (unless you are actually using Brave’s built-in VPN). Your IP address is still your home IP address, you can check that yourself.

    6. NotAMoron said on October 18, 2023 at 9:15 pm
      Reply

      Yet another inflammatory comment by ironheart. The one and only, so the modestly self named.
      Not sure whether english is not your primary language and you failed to get Martin’s meaning or you’re just as clueless and pretentious as you read.

      1. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 7:48 am
        Reply

        > Yet another inflammatory comment by ironheart.

        No, just an accurate one.

    7. Tom Hawack said on October 18, 2023 at 1:24 pm
      Reply

      Most users who prefer a browser over others remain nevertheless open-minded to critics about their browser of choice, but not @Iron Heart. Moreover as usual he tries to set his truth by evoking stupidity when it comes to articles and comments which are not in line with his opinions. Hopeless given this attitude has always been his.

      1. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 1:33 pm
        Reply

        @Tom Hawack

        > Most users who prefer a browser over others remain nevertheless open-minded to critics about their browser of choice, but not @Iron Heart.

        Dude what is there to “criticize”? The background tasks don’t establish any outgoing connection. At most, they occupy a few MB of RAM, that’s it. Crying blue murder over this is stupid and rage bait.

        > Moreover as usual he tries to set his truth by evoking stupidity when it comes to articles and comments which are not in line with his opinions.

        I am calling this stupid because it actually is. The background tasks exist for a reason, to power an opt-in feature. They do not themselves establish any connection or do anything detrimental. The rest is rage bait in which you too, partake. Nothing new either.

      2. Tom Hawack said on October 18, 2023 at 1:52 pm
        Reply

        @Iron Heart, I see nothing “stupid” to react to a browser’s decision to install an OS Service without the user being informed, be this (these) Service(s) activated only on the user’s decision. You could have evoked “overreaction” rather than “stupidity” and explained your viewpoint calmly and respectfully, which would at least brought reliability to your comment. I’m afraid that because of the lack of nuances, because of a straightforward and systematical worship and defense of Brave, condemnation of any other browser, your comments are not reliable. You struggle in the face of evidence, you deny facts. This is quasi childish. I still have fun occasionally reading your obsessions even if I prefer circus’ trapezes to clowns.

      3. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 2:27 pm
        Reply

        @Tom Hawack

        > You struggle in the face of evidence, you deny facts.

        What “facts” do I deny? I don’t deny that the background tasks exist. I am just not OK with the sensationalism, clickbait, rage bait, in which you too happen to partake. That is all. If you think it’s an issue that is worth talking about, you should start by pointing out the negative implications of a background task which establishes no outgoing connection to me. You can’t show me anything there, other than me losing a few MB of RAM. And then you complain when I use words like “stupid” and “rage bait” which are nothing but descriptive and fitting, because that’s what it is, Tom.

        > I still have fun occasionally reading your obsessions even if I prefer circus’ trapezes to clowns.

        I have proven in this very thread that you are a Mozdrone with obvious double standards, I guarantee you that brought me some enjoyment as well. It goes both ways.

      4. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 2:10 pm
        Reply

        I partially support @Iron Heart’s arguments. A browser overloaded with VPN services without user consent is certainly unnecessary.

      5. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 4:55 pm
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        “I partially support @Iron Heart’s arguments. A browser overloaded with VPN services without user consent is certainly unnecessary.”

        Sounds like you actually don’t support his arguments

    8. George said on October 18, 2023 at 1:03 pm
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      There’s no saving this, Iron Heart. Very, very bad move.

      I removed Brave and begrudgingly switched back to Firefox as a secondary browser exactly because of this. The few times I’ll be forced to use a Chromium browser, Edge will have to do.

      I don’t need more browsers installing whatever they feel like. Brave remains my favorite Android browser. Hope they won’t mess that up, too.

      1. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 1:38 pm
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        @George

        Feel free to join the hate bandwagon over background tasks that do nothing other than to install necessary protocols for powering an opt-in feature. Hope you find what you are seeking for with Edge, new privacy issues are reported for this browser on a monthly basis, so might as well use Chrome or Opera, they are no worse than Edge. I am sure Edge will treat you, the user, with the kind of respect Brave apparently failed to treat you with. Good luck on your journey.

      2. George said on October 18, 2023 at 11:15 pm
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        @Iron Heart, you are not reading, either. Not joining hate bandwagons or seek anything in Edge. I know it sucks hard, so does Firefox and Brave probably remains better than both. I merely said I don’t need yet another browser installing stuff without my consent.

        You keep talking about performance, few MB of RAM, no VPN until activated etc. None of this is the point. A Web Browser should not install Windows Services or anything else without consent, period.

        I already have to deal with Pale Moon’s non-mainstreamness, then Firefox for testing and deal with Mozilla’s crap on each update. Then, I am forced by a few primitive websites to use Chromium and watch over Microsoft’s crap. So, I had to ditch one browser – four is too many and I don’t need Brave’s crap to watch over, too.

        I might still recommend Brave to Chromium-only users, I’m just not one of them. And btw, is there a way to the transfer a @#$ Chromium browser user profile to another PC as-is? Every time I tried, extensions will be missing or something will go wrong. I hate this unreliability. Sync is not an option.

      3. Iron Heart said on October 19, 2023 at 8:00 am
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        @George

        > I merely said I don’t need yet another browser installing stuff without my consent.

        But that’s… what you are getting with Edge? On a monthly basis too. Microsoft kind of pioneered the concept of installing background tasks, but contrary to Brave, the tasks Microsoft installs usually are meant to siphon off your data. If that improves your situation, I don’t know. Do what you have to, it’s your system, not mine.

        > You keep talking about performance, few MB of RAM, no VPN until activated etc. None of this is the point.

        OK, what is the point then? The protocols are necessary so that the built-in VPN can work. Drop the protocols and you need to also drop the built-in VPN, which is there to help fund the development of the browser, given that some Brave users are using it / paying for it. I have no problem with the background tasks, I understand what feature they are meant to power and that they are not connecting anywhere by themselves. I see no reason to disable them or to remove them, they do not negatively impact me in any way, shape, or form. Not even my detractors here can demonstrate how they are negatively impacting me despite me asking for such info.

        > So, I had to ditch one browser – four is too many and I don’t need Brave’s crap to watch over, too.

        Ever heard of Ungoogled Chromium? Not that it’s an improvement over Brave, you lose fingerprinting defenses and adblocking will suck hard once Manifest V3 hits (just like it will in Edge), but at least it won’t install those evil background tasks which do nothing unless you actually use the VPN. So, UGC for the win, I guess.

        > I might still recommend Brave to Chromium-only users, I’m just not one of them. And btw, is there a way to the transfer a @#$ Chromium browser user profile to another PC as-is? Every time I tried, extensions will be missing or something will go wrong. I hate this unreliability. Sync is not an option.

        Genuinely you should not copy profiles just like that, since vital files are also stored in locations not covered by the main profile folder (which is how you lost the extensions), but admittedly I have done it in the past as well. There are better backup and restore options than that, some of them provided by the OS itself.

      4. George said on October 19, 2023 at 12:55 pm
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        @Iron Heart the ONLY reason I chose Edge on those occasions Chromium is required, is that it comes pre-installed. So, I have to deal with it whether I like it or not. It’s not easy to remove it and doing so might even cause Windows issues. I know there are better alternatives but since it’s there, I’ll use it. It’ll never become the main, or even secondary browser.

      5. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 1:30 pm
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        Any halfway normal person looking at the replies my comment has received will find what I said 100% confirmed. The VPN is one way to fund development of the browser, it is fully opt-in though, and the services required for its operation do NOT establish any outgoing connection on their own. I genuinely wonder if the same people crying about the background services which do nothing other than use a few MB of your precious RAM have also disabled all the background services of Windows itself, some of which are actually sending data to Microsoft. If you want to go hunt for background tasks, then perhaps you should look at those first before you get around talking about standard VPN protocols that do nothing unless you actually use the VPN, lmao.

        Most people here are Mozilla sockpuppets anyway and surprise, surprise: _https://www.ghacks.net/2020/04/09/mozilla-installs-scheduled-telemetry-task-on-windows-with-firefox-75/_

        Mozilla is installing telemetry background tasks that spy on your default browser (even if it isn’t Firefox) and actually send the info back to Mozilla HQ. Surely, that is not an issue according to the resident Mozdrones but Brave’s offline background tasks are a major problem. Similarly, they cried blue murder when Brave had a generic referral link on Binance (that could not even have been used to track anyone individually) but have zero problem with Firefox rewriting any and all Google search URLs to add its own referral to them, which too is for generating money (Google Search deal).

        This website is pretty much gone, only ignorance left and the obvious clickbait headlines are not helping its cause either.

        I would call this out IF there was actually any issue for the user arising here regarding user privacy, but there isn’t. If the browser has a VPN, why can’t it ship with the protocols necessary for its operation? It does not get any better or worse from this from the user’s point of view. You can see the VPN itself as bloat or whatever, but guess what, the browser needs to fund itself somehow, especially if it doesn’t have the privilege to be Google’s lapdog and long-term search engine leech.

      6. Anonymous said on October 19, 2023 at 9:42 pm
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        It may be opt in, but it is not FULLY opt in IF it runs services (I can’t check ‘cos I don’t run Brave).

        Harking back to your comment, ‘people have genuinely grown stupid’, you are right. Increasingly, people make scathing remarks and bring down the tone of the internet.

    9. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 12:42 pm
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      Where were you in the Brave lays off news? True, you didn’t even comment.

      1. Iron Heart said on October 18, 2023 at 1:35 pm
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        @Anonymous

        > Where were you in the Brave lays off news? True, you didn’t even comment.

        Want a comment? Doubt they will go under because they shed 9% of their staff just like most of Silicon Valley laid off part of their workforce these days. This is my comment, hope you are happy and satisfied now.

    10. Scarecrow Legs said on October 18, 2023 at 12:01 pm
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      found the straw man

    11. Steel Mind said on October 18, 2023 at 11:56 am
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      The browser should not install any services not related to its immediate task without the user’s knowledge and permission.
      Otherwise, this is typical trojan behavior.

      And if there are vulnerabilities in these installed services, then even if they are disabled by default, it still increases the potential attack surface.

      P.S.
      I think some bravew?nker in comments is overstepping his bounds in his attacks on a completely neutral article that simply states the facts.

    12. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 10:33 am
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      @IH
      >People have genuinely grown stupid

      You never fail to offend people to claim your IQ, and that makes you a sad human being.

    13. Igor said on October 18, 2023 at 9:22 am
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      You are eluding two facts. 1) peoples want a browser, not necessarly a VPN. Bloated software are shit. 2) No one was warned before this installation. You are fine with stuff like that installed without you knowing? What about, you know, consenting? 3) people may already have a vpn, who cares about brave shit?

      I expected no less from the Ghack’s resident Brave shill. Are you swimming in BATS right now?

    14. Anonymous said on October 18, 2023 at 9:00 am
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      This is such a stupid argument. They could have just made it in a way that only installs the services when the user expresses that they want to use the VPN. This is the same type of scummy shit they did with auto injecting their own referral codes into links.

    15. John said on October 18, 2023 at 8:43 am
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      Talk about putting one’s foot in it: Martin claimed no more than that Brave installs VPN services without user consent.

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