The death of Classic Theme Restorer for Firefox

The Classic Theme Restorer add-on for Firefox will stop working when Mozilla releases Firefox 57.0 Stable, and Firefox 59.0 ESR.

Classic Theme Restorer was developed as a direct response to Mozilla refreshing Firefox with the Australis theme release in Firefox 29.

The add-on allows Firefox users to restore many theme features that Mozilla removed and changed with the Australis launch, or introduced with it.

The extension grew quickly, and features an immense set of features and tweaks nowadays that give you control over many features of the browser. Check out 10 reasons for Classic Theme Restorer to find out more about the add-on's functionality.

The death of Classic Theme Restorer for Firefox

classic theme restorer dead

Back in November 2016, we suggested that Classic Theme Restorer might be dead once Mozilla makes the full switch to WebExtensions exclusively in Firefox.

We based this on posts by Aris, the developer of the add-on who stated that the extension will be dead by the end of 2017. Reasons given at that time were that Mozilla had not come up with WebExtension APIs that would allow the add-on to be ported, and then continued as a WebExtension.

If you check out the official add-on page of Classic Theme Restorer on Mozilla's AMO site today, you will notice the following paragraph at the top:

This add-on will stop working when Firefox 57 arrives in November 2017 and Mozilla drops support for XUL / XPCOM / legacy add-ons. It should still work on Firefox 52 ESR until ESR moves to Firefox 59 ESR in 2018 (~Q2).

There is no "please port it" or "please add support for it" this time, because the entire add-on eco system changes and the technology behind this kind of add-on gets dropped without replacement.

Aris posted a request on Bugzilla to get Mozilla to introduce APIs that would allow him to port the add-on, but Mozilla marked the request as Wontfix. This means basically, that Mozilla won't create the APIs required to port Classic Theme Restorer, and many of the other add-ons that require this kind of access.

While the new theme API may introduce some features, it is too limited to create a viable WebExtension version of Classic Theme Restorer.

Classic Theme Restorer, at the time of writing, is one of the highest rated add-ons on AMO. It has a five star rating based on 1176 user reviews, and more than 413,000 users at the time of writing.

413,000 users may not be much when compared to Firefox's total population. Most of these users have -- likely -- used Firefox for years, even before the Australis days.

There is not much Firefox users can do about it if they rely on add-ons that cannot or won't be ported to WebExtensions. Sticking with the last working build may work for a time, but it means that security issues will pile up, and that support for new web technologies won't find its way into the browser either.

Switching to third-party ports may be an option, but it remains to be seen how many of those will survive the year 2017. The developer of Cyberfox stated recently for instance that the browser will reach end of life with the release of Firefox 52.x ESR.

Pale Moon will survive, but that is the only web browser based on Firefox that we know of that will do so.

Now You: If you are affected by the change, what's your plan moving forward?

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The death of Classic Theme Restorer for Firefox
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The Classic Theme Restorer add-on for Firefox will stop working when Mozilla releases Firefox 57.0 Stable, and Firefox 59.0 ESR.
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Responses to The death of Classic Theme Restorer for Firefox

  1. Ash March 8, 2017 at 3:24 pm #

    Pale moon, I choose you!

    • Matt A. Tobin March 8, 2017 at 4:04 pm #

      Pale Moon used Sane UI
      It's super effective!

    • Jed March 8, 2017 at 5:18 pm #

      I dislike the Palemoon UI immensely, it looks unsightly and like it belongs on XP. Not only that, but upon opening it I found an immediate bug.

      • Venom88 March 9, 2017 at 9:26 am #

        I agree the default UI is not so cool (even if it is actually based on the Classic Theme), but there are nice themes to customize it.
        I use Australium which makes the browser look like the actual Firefox.

      • Nili March 9, 2017 at 12:49 pm #

        Doesn't look at all like XP on my side.
        http://c1.staticflickr.com/1/516/31052746764_9dcb1f5b31_o.png

        If you've found a bug on PM, maybe report it?

        Default PM UI can be customized like you want, unlike Mozilla Firefox where they can't let you do much.

        Well, day by day i become convinced that i did the best forsake Mozilla Firefox. I regret that have used since the early days.

      • Jed March 9, 2017 at 8:37 pm #

        Fair enough, personally I prefer the Firefox UI, and no offence, but that screenshot does look very XP-esque (from that era) or at least looks very old.

      • Jed March 9, 2017 at 8:42 pm #

        Not only that, but Palemoon is based off of Firefox 38 ESR I believe, and just checking on html5test.com shows bad results. It is far behind Chrome and Firefox and therefore useless to me. Because it does not support HTML5 properly, several websites I use, and one I have made do not display properly.

      • Nili March 10, 2017 at 9:20 am #

        @Jed, It's just a selected theme on my side, I don't think looks XP. Yes, a classic ones but not XP.
        There are planty other different, modern or classic to select.
        https://addons.palemoon.org/themes/

        Maybe give a try sometimes :)

        Regards!

    • Radrick March 8, 2017 at 7:20 pm #

      I will also be switching to Pale Moon.

    • www.con March 9, 2017 at 8:36 am #

      Palemoon won't last if it doesn't have any XUL / XPCOM addons to work with it.

      Without that, it will become a featureless browser much the same way IE11 is.

      What are you gonna do then?

      • LimboSlam March 10, 2017 at 2:17 am #

        @Jed and anyone else who prefers Australis look (I am one of them), Pale Moon has a dedicated designer/themeist who created Australium: https://addons.palemoon.org/themes/australium/. Also, read these quotes:

        "And last but not least in this section, as expected, people find the ability to use a gamepad to control/interface with the browser absolutely not useful or desired. As a result, we'll be removing this feature from Pale Moon.

        Of note, it's decisions like these that lower our "score" in things like HTML5 tests. That doesn't mean we don't properly support the standard, but rather that "gadgeteer use" of the browser is kept under control. It's part of the standard, but it's not useful for our audience and eveything like this added to the browser makes the code more complex and potentially more vulnerable to attack."

        "Please note that current, popular "benchmarks" are extremely limited in what they test and the way they test "browser speed". Pale Moon does not aim to have an "as high as possible benchmark score" and may not perform well in a number of these so-called micro-benchmarks, but instead focuses heavily on overall browser smoothness, CPU usage, efficient networking and program-wide optimizations not related to a certain (limited) subset of functions. Benchmarks, by definition, do not provide a real world browsing scenario, and should not be relied on to determine "which browser is faster or better.""

        "Website compatibility. As long as websites keep specifically checking for and catering to (specific versions of) only 3 or 4 "mainstream" browsers, you will always have some sites that will not cooperate with using an independent alternative. On the browser side, there is very little we can do to prevent this. As a user, however, you have the power to convince websites to give this attention by contacting webmasters of troublesome sites and making them aware of their restrictions."

        @www.con, only time will tell. However, I can tell you that many extension/add-on developers have adapted to Pale Moon or are in the transition of doing so. See here: https://addons.palemoon.org/extensions/category/all/. They also have two developer wikis set up for Extensions and Themes: https://developer.palemoon.org/Add-ons:Site, https://developer.palemoon.org/Pale_Moon_Theme_Changes.

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 8:47 am #

        >Pale Moon has a dedicated designer/themeist who created Australium: https://addons.palemoon.org/themes/australium/

        LOL - Now wait a minute. Wasn't one of the big reasons Pale Moon was set up to begin with was to fight against this Firefox-imposed Australis theme? Now it's hypocritical to say the least.

        Interesting quotes. Not surprised though, since they've been operating as a minuscule one-man shop (with a couple of part-time volunteers) since the beginning.

        - 'Forget gamepad. No need to connect to games or enrich the browsing experience. All you need is our sloppy half-rendered interface to do a half-assed job for you, circa 2006'
        - 'If HTML5 doesn't render properly? Who cares'
        - 'So what if our browser is a slug when it comes to benchmarks. Who cares'
        - 'So what if the website isn't compatible with our browser. It isn't our fault. Websites should cater to us, not the other way around'

        That's the attitude I'm reading. Luddite thinking at it's core.

        @LimboSlam, I only see two active volunteers to their addon developer list. And two alumni? What does that mean? They used to be there but went on to better things?

        (head shaking) :D

      • LimboSlam March 11, 2017 at 6:46 am #

        @www.con: Lol, you're too funny; I don't know why I waste my patience with guys like you (head shaking :D!).

        Well... Sadly, all I'm seeing is ignorant replies. It's all good, I was their at point in my life as well.

      • Lord Lestat March 11, 2017 at 11:54 am #

        This browser has at least built inside UI customization. You can do that without add-ons. Australis Firefox offered that only with add-ons. XUL-less Firefox offers ui customization over add-ons only in a very limited way. Add-ons are a lame band-aid. Only features fully built inside the core product are of value. And customization belongs to the core of a product.

        You are a built-inside features hater. Almost Chrome clone fanatics and simple users like you are one @www.con, are the reason why features get dumbed down instead of being more richer and more complex.

      • www.com March 12, 2017 at 8:53 am #

        @LimboSlam, everything I said was true, you just don't like to hear it, although I too did have a great laugh at your excuses here.

        Maybe you and that idiotic troll @Lord Lestat should start a new sock puppet club. Invite @CelticSuperwarrior (or whatever his ridiculous name was) to join in. At least we can see you all talking to yourselves.

        lol.. :D

      • Repo March 21, 2017 at 10:34 pm #

        @www.con Quite entertaining to see the paid Mozilla shill brigade in action. Tell me shill, how much has Mozilla paid you to support their customization less future?

        Or have they abused your body in a well... not sober way? Guys like you should be either buried or sent to space with the capsule blown up right after you leave the planet.

        Disgusting prick! Mozilla must be desperate to hire guys like you to attack all the one's who are the tiniest bit of not enthusiastic about their Chrome clone future :D

  2. lord lestat March 8, 2017 at 3:38 pm #

    And what that means dear boys and girls, means that everyone who said that customization will die was in the end right.

    Quite amusing that that Firefox supporter at the end of that Bugzilla entry dreams that Firefox meets Chrome's market share and surpassing it.

    Too bad that there is already a Chrome available and no matter what Mozilla does to make Firefox as close to Chrome as possible, most Chrome users will never switch. Also there is only an ending amount of users available and the only users which would enable Mozilla to surpass Chrome are the Chrome users themselves.

    Anyway, that is not the point. Again Mozilla shows that they have not the tiniest bit of respect - none for their users and also non for awesome add-on developers like Aris and Classic Theme Restorer.

    Mozilla is today a corrupted organization and nothing is going to change in that department in the future.

  3. Anonymous March 8, 2017 at 3:49 pm #

    American Indians accompany their ancestors on the mountain to help them die, at the opposite Mozilla prefers to finish off its old users. This is what they call modernism, uplifting for a so-called "decent" browser.

  4. sillybones March 8, 2017 at 4:01 pm #

    >Pale Moon will survive, but that is the only web browser based on Firefox that we know of that will do so.

    Good luck with that. I wouldn't advise using a terribly out-of-date browser engine just to tweak some UI. Use Vivaldi instead.

    Frankly I don't understand why Aris never just made a proper fork instead of an addon. Between him and Moonchild, by now we could have had a Pale Moon type browser which isn't based on badly outdated Firefox code, but just has its own "better" UI that looks and feels like the old one.

    I guess some people just like to constantly pissing in the wind and then getting mad when Firefox devs tell them "no, we're trying to move AWAY from these flimsy techniques, not keep them."

    • Corky March 8, 2017 at 7:39 pm #

      If you knew what you were talking about you'd be dangerous.

    • Ray March 8, 2017 at 8:05 pm #

      Pale Moon is a fringe browser.

      It might get more exposure when Firefox 57 is released, but I'd rather use SeaMonkey instead.

      SeaMonkey would be based on ESR as well, but already would support more Firefox addons than Pale Moon ever would (via a compatibility tweak).

      You could argue that SeaMonkey is also a fringe browser! :)

      • Ferenn March 8, 2017 at 10:36 pm #

        SeaMonkey likely has fewer active users at this point than Pale Moon.

        In addition, SeaMonkey's application code is also XUL-based, and will similarly not have a future riding mozilla-central because their application code will no longer have a platform to use.

        Pale Moon's dev team is also working on making the three by Mozilla marked "legacy" add-on technologies as accessible for extension developers as possible, so, where would that leave the more limited SeaMonkey add-ons?

      • www.com March 9, 2017 at 8:51 am #

        @Ferenn

        And how many end users does Palemoon have? 50,000? 75,000?

        A minuscule amount, but if you can find add-on developers who will cater to a tiny audience then good luck. ;)

      • www.com March 18, 2017 at 7:36 am #

        @q

        That doesn't tell me anything other than they aren't sure of it themselves.

        Try again.

      • q March 18, 2017 at 3:36 pm #

        @www.com
        Vivaldi market share 0.03% >1 mln users
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vivaldi_%28web_browser%29#Market_share (February 2017)
        https://www.cnet.com/news/souped-up-vivaldi-browser-nabs-nearly-a-million-users/ (May 2016)

        Pale Moon market share 0.02% >0.02/0.03 mln=>0.67mln users
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pale_Moon_%28web_browser%29#Market_share (February 2017)

      • ZippyDSMlee March 18, 2017 at 5:44 pm #

        Uhg I went back to FF 46, palemoon breaks some of my plugins, new FF breaks most of my plugins I give I will just use 46 till hell freezes over or a well supported non chrome/FF browser offers decent plug ins.

    • LimboSlam March 9, 2017 at 6:01 am #

      Hahaha.

      @sillybones, you're a perfect example of what an uninformed user looks like. Come on now, even my 9th graders know how to do their research.

      -PS: SeaMonkey is facing the same faith as Firefox... I hope they get their silent act together.

      • Corky March 9, 2017 at 8:31 am #

        You don't even need to research anything to know what sillybones said is false, any 9th grader would be able to tell you something only becomes outdated when it's no longer being worked on, that something like a roof only starts leaking when you stop maintaining it.

      • Heimen Stoffels March 9, 2017 at 10:57 am #

        Actually, SeaMonkey has announced in their last meeting that they're going to collaborate with the Thunderbird devs. That will increase the number of devs, at least for the time being. They've said that they have no plan yet after Mozilla drops support for FF 52 (which SeaMonkey will eventually be based on).

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 6:00 am #

        @Corky, if it can't even render webpages and HTML5 properly, then yes it's outdated.

        There's only so much defibrillation you can do to a dinosaur.

      • Corky March 10, 2017 at 9:45 am #

        @www.com, Feel free to provide links and/or reports of instances where pale moon can't render webpages and HTML5 properly, speaking from personal experience I've never come across these problems and until you provide more information i have to assume you're spreading FUD.

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 11:38 am #

        @Corky, I will download the portable version and test it again. Maybe in the two years since I last used it, it has risen from the level of mediocrity it was then.

      • www.com March 11, 2017 at 6:04 am #

        >Feel free to provide links and/or reports of instances where pale moon can't render webpages and HTML5 properly, speaking from personal experience I've never come across these problems and until you provide more information i have to assume you're spreading FUD.

        @Corky, go to html5test.com and see for yourself.

        How do I describe it?

        EPIC FAIL

        @Corky, it doesn't take rocket science to see that Palemoon is an old code fringe browser run by a protest luddite who has little money and a tiny user base. When those Mozilla add-on webpages disappear, they're gone. Truly gone. No more extensions from Mozilla.

        You all might be able to port a few old extensions, but you will never have what Mozilla had. Even the Chrome store will offer more than you all will ever be able to hope to do. All because you all refuse to move beyond 2006 technology with a silly hang-up over Australis.

        So no more piggybacking and freeloading off of Mozilla, which what they've been doing since the beginning. You all will have to stand 100% on your own feet now.

    • ZippyDSMlee March 9, 2017 at 1:59 pm #

      A shame chrome plugins are so limited they suck badly.

    • ZippyDSMlee March 9, 2017 at 2:02 pm #

      I've tried but the UI and lack of plugins I want make Vivaldi and most chrome stuff useless for me.... might as well use edge with no plugins or options in it altogether...

  5. ShintoPlasm March 8, 2017 at 4:03 pm #

    Holy ****! And we were hoping that Mozilla would make good on their word and "actively work with extension developers" to recreate API equivalents in the new WebExtension world. Bugger, guess that won't happen.

    • Cucurucu March 8, 2017 at 4:44 pm #

      Beyond promises... in the practice, any WE API added to Firefox must be supported indefinitely by Fx developers, so they need to choose what to add or not. APIs too niche, or possible to be abused by unscrupulous add-ons, or too complex to maintain, or too much "generic" or powerful (as open access to about:config flags) so it's hard to gauge how Fx changes break an add-on using this API, are all expected to be rejected. Add-ons as CTR or TMP (offering a lot of tweaks over the Firefox UI) are all likely to disappear, or reborn in a much more limited form, a little more powerful to those currently available in Google Chrome.

      • Kendall March 8, 2017 at 7:03 pm #

        Which is basically all done for Chrome users who are happy enough with a limited feature set.

        Let's just say how it is: Mozilla hopes that they manage to gain with privacy features, a Chrome similar UI, a Chrome similar feature set quite a lot of Chrome users.

        They could have supported ui customization if they would have wanted to do so and if they are not going fully simple users only. But they have shown that they are not interested anymore in a more deeper feature set.

        No one believes that security garbage. That was for sure a part of it. But in the end, it is all to satisfy Chrome users. The own user base does not count anymore.

        The most used term recently found in Mozilla resources is "Chrome parity" - that alone says everything.

        Mozilla has turned their status of well respected into a bunch of lame Google fanboys.

      • Jackson March 8, 2017 at 7:28 pm #

        Done only to attract simple users. It is logical. Remove all features which noobs are not going to use and hope that most of them jump ship whatever browser they are using.

        Mozilla is like Opera - a total failure which got blinded by too much possible money in reach.

        Power users made Mozilla a big guy in the business and so are we getting paid back. If Mozilla still would posess the tiniest bit of a soul they should rename themselves and the browser to something else.

        This construct is neither Firefox and that organization is also not Mozilla. Mozilla was always about giving users powerful weapons and not about following the mainstream because there is tons of money down the road.

        Mozilla should get slapped as long in the face until they are coming back to their senses. Seriously. The only browser developer which was earning that more than Mozilla was Opera.

        Indeed, there is only one word which is a perfect match. And that is plain and simple assholes!

    • Ferenn March 8, 2017 at 10:39 pm #

      Mozilla has made an empty promise to work with extension developers - I predicted that this would remain extremely limited to a very very small number of extensions like Adblock Plus. Because Mozilla doesn't want the "maintenance cost" for additional APIs, or rather, they want to ultimately be in full control.
      And anyone knows the Mozilla UX team has always hated CTR for not agreeing with what they think is a "superior UI", aerodynamic tabs and all... So of course it was predictable that APIs to make customization possible not in line with Australis would become a "wontfix".

      • Daja March 9, 2017 at 8:11 am #

        That is the point. They hate customization, as features like that stand in their way to make simpler users switch over to Firefox.

        Features and feature loving users are no longer of importance for Mozilla. The whole UX team is a bunch of Chrome admirer while the leadership of Mozilla sees the chance that more users will increase Firefox weight and influence like Google in the direction of which drafts and standards are getting implemented for example in the ES Script section.

        Mozilla is basically abandoning their older ideology for a possible increase of importance as they still try to defeat and destroy Google Chrome. But with offering a simple product they can't win because Google is the king of simplicity.

        This is like fighting fire with fire. I hate people who are dishonest. This is scum behavior. How can you believe in pathological liars and a money addicted and money decision driven leadership which is spitting in the face of the same user base which supported the product for such a long time.

        There is no other way around of calling it that way, being dishonest and being liars is shameful and a behavior only expected to be done by scum.

  6. manicmac March 8, 2017 at 4:23 pm #

    Went to palemoon years ago, not looked back at all. Firefox lost me ages ago by not listening to their users!

  7. WulfTheSaxon March 8, 2017 at 4:43 pm #

    “We also recognize that a property manifest won’t have all the capabilities of direct CSS manipulation, especially during the time we’re expanding coverage to cover the most common use cases. So, for theme authors who need additional capabilities (and are willing to bear the burden of supporting them), we’ll provide an ‘experimental’ section of the manifest to continue to allow direct CSS manipulation of the Firefox UI. This is similar in spirit to WebExtension Experiments, and usage will also be restricted to pre-release versions of Firefox.” ( https://blog.mozilla.org/addons/2017/02/24/improving-themes-in-firefox/ )

    So direct CSS access will be restricted to pre-release versions, but couldn’t a WebExtension just instruct users to change whatever about:config pref they’ll be using to restrict it?

    • Cucurucu March 9, 2017 at 3:08 am #

      There will not be an about:config flag for it, in the same way that, by example, currently there aren't a about:config flag to disable add-on signing in release versions.

      • Heimen Stoffels March 9, 2017 at 10:59 am #

        Wrong. You can add xpinstall.signatures.required to about:config and set it to false to disable add-on signing.

  8. Marcin March 8, 2017 at 5:13 pm #

    OMG, saddest news of the day !!
    This one [CTR] is certainly the most important add-on I have with the ad-blocker.

    Firefox is driving me crazy.

    I will look at Pale Moon, as suggested in the article.
    I also keep an eye on Vivaldi.

  9. mike March 8, 2017 at 5:16 pm #

    I know that plenty people, will be pissed off about this. But honestly, I feel that the Developer theme is much better than classic ever was.

    • mike March 9, 2017 at 7:06 pm #

      Seems FF53 will include light and dark compact themes as well, nice.

  10. Michael Tobias March 8, 2017 at 5:36 pm #

    Switched to Vivaldi about a year ago and haven't looked back.

    • trek100 March 8, 2017 at 6:47 pm #

      @Michael or @all-

      Is Vivaldi slower than FF or Pale Moon?

      (that's what I heard in other comments...
      so I wanted to hear from a Vivaldi user).

      I currently use Pale Moon
      and it's faster than FF, which I use occasionally.

      Thanks f/your feedback
      on Vivaldi performance!.

    • kubrick March 8, 2017 at 9:45 pm #

      I see nothing in vivaldi which would interest me.its chrome with a different coat on.
      I have been using palemoon and its the best of the lot.

      • Heimen Stoffels March 9, 2017 at 11:00 am #

        Vivaldi has way more features than Chrome will ever have. Not to mention the fact Vivaldi supports customization of the UI through JS and CSS (although for the time being there's no GUI way of doing that, but it's very easy to create a custom file to do it just like on FF).

  11. mma173 March 8, 2017 at 5:37 pm #

    RIP Firefox

  12. Pepito Grillo March 8, 2017 at 5:50 pm #

    Hi Martin, Apparently you will need to create a new whole site section to hold all those "The death of [put-extension-name-here] for Firefox" articles, and that section will eventually have more articles than the rest of the site if you're gonna comment every add-on that will stop working... not sure if laugh or cry, so sad and upset with Mozilla.

  13. pHROZEN gHOST March 8, 2017 at 5:52 pm #

    Is Google paying Mozilla to kill Firefox?

    • Ferenn March 8, 2017 at 10:42 pm #

      They don't have to. Mozilla's short-sightedness does that all on its own!

    • Graham March 9, 2017 at 1:59 am #

      Not anymore. Google used to pay Mozilla due to a 5-year contract they had, but that contract has long expired. They're teamed to the hip with Yahoo! now.

  14. Jeff-FL March 8, 2017 at 5:58 pm #

    Mozilla is doing everything it can to run off power users. When they kill my reasons to stay, I'll be heading to Vivaldi or something else.

  15. Belga March 8, 2017 at 6:28 pm #

    Waterfox if it will not end as Cyberfox.

    • www.com March 9, 2017 at 8:58 am #

      I think it will, unfortunately... :(

      • Heimen Stoffels March 9, 2017 at 11:03 am #

        Please, don't spread false hopes. The Waterfox dev has already said that development will continue: https://www.reddit.com/r/waterfox/comments/5y1hv5/cyberfox_is_dead/
        "Waterfox development is going to continue, I'll divulge more details with the next release."

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 6:07 am #

        Well @Heimen Stoffels, I hope I'm wrong here. I would certainly use Waterfox before I'd even consider an old relic dinosaur like Pale Moon.

        They may have to follow Firefox into abandoning the XUL / XPCOM addon model and going the WebExtensions route, though.

    • monk March 17, 2017 at 9:46 am #

      Thanks. I moved from Cyberfox to Waterfox yesterday.

  16. mike March 8, 2017 at 6:29 pm #

    Mozilla want to clone chrome, fine.
    I'm happy with previous PC versions for now.

    Yes there are features I might miss
    and the ever looming question of security.
    Why though should I update on PC?

    I have new firefox on android,
    which is very poor,
    frequent crashes, poor rendering times, slow response.
    It offers more control than Chrome,
    which is what I'm after,
    not less.

    When W7 goes I may change altogether.

    • Jed March 8, 2017 at 11:48 pm #

      Why should you update? One you've already mentioned - security, which as the browser gets older will be worse. Another reason is that web standards will change and move on, and it will get to a point where you will not be able to use the web with that browser. It's better to either stay on the latest version of Firefox, or move to another browser; be it Opera, Chrome, Edge or something else modern.

  17. Kendall March 8, 2017 at 6:34 pm #

    Mozilla exchanges advanced users against Google users. There is nothing more pathetic and laughable than that.

    And extension developers and advanced users have to pay the bill. Mozilla is the most annoying browser developer today with the most ignorant developers.

    Can't believe Mozilla is truly guessing they manage to make all Chrome users switch with that annoying changes. Too bad that it does not work that way as they want it to work. But they will realize that soon enough.

    Mozilla.... lap-dog of Google today. Even Microsoft can be taken more seriously as compared with that team of losers.

  18. hylen March 8, 2017 at 6:58 pm #

    What about just not updating Firefox? I'm on 44.01 here now and it has everything I want. What's the downside?

    • Corky March 8, 2017 at 7:50 pm #

      Without updates you risk being exposed to exploits, using older versions is fine if someone is actively patching it to close any discovered vulnerabilities, however Mozilla only do that for a year at most.

  19. Jeff March 8, 2017 at 7:16 pm #

    Just like Windows 10, only idiots use Firefox still. The smart ones all use Windows 7 or 8.1 and Pale Moon or Chrome or Opera.

    • asdf March 8, 2017 at 8:21 pm #

      The smart ones all use Linux and Pale Moon or Chromium.

    • DComedian March 8, 2017 at 8:41 pm #

      I must be an idiot, but Firefox extensions enable me to do all sorts of things that I can't do using Chrome or Opera, and some of those Firefox extensions don't work in Pale Moon.

      I have all these browsers, plus Vivaldi, Sea Monkey etc installed. I've only recently started using Sea Monkey, and it seems an excellent lightweight browser that I didn't previously know very much about?

      I have recently switched to Chrome as my primary browser because it seems much more stable than Firefox, and currently use Firefox as a secondary browser to do those things that can't be done in Chrome because there is no equivalent extension. The switch to Chrome was a major wrench, given my dedication to all things Firefox over the past 10+ years, during which time I must have tried out hundreds (maybe thousands?!) of extensions.

      The loss of Classic Theme Restorer will be a blow, and I guess it's a case of "wait and see" with regards to which extensions continue to work after November 2017.

    • www.com March 9, 2017 at 8:59 am #

      @asdf, the smart ones don't listen to people like you.

      • asdf March 9, 2017 at 4:51 pm #

        "There are no men like me, only me."

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 5:43 am #

        @asdf

        Yes, snowflake. Whatever you say.

      • asdf March 10, 2017 at 7:51 pm #

        @www.com

        You're not just the king of smart, you're the king of cool, too. Amazing! I might start using Chrome, Firefox and Windows after all!

        Not.

      • www.com March 12, 2017 at 9:00 am #

        @asdf

        Go for it, snowflake. I wish you the best. lol

      • asdf March 12, 2017 at 1:40 pm #

        @www.com

        All I needed was your blessing and your precious smile! Thank you sir, you're just too kind.

        Love,
        Your favorite snowflake.

  20. LewS March 8, 2017 at 7:22 pm #

    Do you not functions SeaMonkey to be
    based on Firefox?

    Granted it will lose XUL capability
    eventually, but will work well into
    2018.

    • www.com March 9, 2017 at 9:06 am #

      "Granted it will lose XUL capability
      eventually, but will work well into
      2018."

      So will Firefox ESR. We have about a year with CTR left on that. A lot can happen in that time.

  21. Aube Bleue March 8, 2017 at 8:04 pm #

    My plan? Pale Moon, of course. It's been my default browser for the last two years, and I'm very pleased with it. Pale Moon is a miracle sent from above; actually, from Sweden. :D

  22. name5567 March 8, 2017 at 8:08 pm #

    noooo. it's the only reason I use firefox.

  23. NAC.com March 8, 2017 at 8:16 pm #

    Mozilla Firefox will die soon and no one will remember it later. Boycott them and not losing your precious time.

    Use Pale Moon, Chrome or Opera instead

  24. Tony March 8, 2017 at 8:31 pm #

    This is very sad. Mozilla is dumbing down Firefox to the point that it will just be a Chrome clone.

    I encourage everyone to voice their opinion here:
    https://qsurvey.mozilla.com/s3/FirefoxInput/

    • Anonymous March 10, 2017 at 4:23 pm #

      Done! Thanks! I also encourage the community to speak out...

  25. WildcatRay March 8, 2017 at 8:41 pm #

    More & more, I am using either Opera or Chrome. At least with them, I am not being bombarded with unwanted & no-value features like Mozilla has been doing with their bloatware, er, rather, system add-ons that I have no need or want for because they do not relate to the basic web browsing function.

  26. Jackson March 8, 2017 at 8:48 pm #

    Hmm... Isn't that called censorship?

    https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1328244

    Hiding one comment which is supporting customization and leaving one unchanged which is basically supporting the Google Chrome clone way?

    Mozilla not only was spitting on people who supported traditional alues in Firefox with not supporting Brendan Eich, they decided that the Google Chrome clone way is best and actively putting rocks in the way the free right of expression of people who do not agree with what Mozilla does.

    There is actually no word which describes how contemptible Mozilla has become.

  27. karlo2105 March 8, 2017 at 9:11 pm #

    I will give a try to Seamonkey when Firefox drops Xul. What pissed me off the most with Firefox was Australis theme with lack of customisation and as Seamonkey looks like good old Firefox, it should be ok. They will not drop xul. Palemoon will be my ultimate choice.
    Shame on you Mozilla. I use Firefox since 2005 and as i don't want to use chrome like browser i don't have any choice but to switch.

  28. Romain March 8, 2017 at 9:45 pm #

    Terrible news! My Firefox will be totally unusable without CTR :( And to think that I've been recommending Firefox to everyone until last month... I'll have to stay in v52 ESR forever. Could we sign a petition to see if Mozilla reconsiders it?

  29. anon6484920 March 8, 2017 at 9:57 pm #

    Question to all the Pale moon fans

    What makes you think that your favorite one man project browser won't have the same fate as the recent announcement of the death of Cyberfox? right!

    Mark my words, in 1 max 2 years from now Pale moon will be an abandonware.

    • www.com March 9, 2017 at 9:02 am #

      @anon6484920, maybe even less time than that. They can't keep running that dinosaur code forever.

      And with no XUL / XPCOM addon webpages to piggyback off of anymore, what will they do.

      • Sinon March 9, 2017 at 2:31 pm #

        @www.com if you think that Pale Moon is running "dinosaur code" than you could not be any further from the truth.

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 5:48 am #

        @Sinon your loyalty is strong for a dinosaur browser that looks like something out of XP

        Let's see how long it survives after Mozilla starts taking down all those XUL / XPCOM addon webpages. And that will happen, ya know... It's only a question of when.

      • Corky March 10, 2017 at 9:56 am #

        @www.com, Maybe you should use a different pejorative than dinosaur seeing how they were the most successful creatures to ever walk the earth, if humans make it to 175 million years then maybe we can start saying dinosaur were a failure.

    • LimboSlam March 10, 2017 at 2:34 am #

      @anon6484920, it's not a "one man project." See Rumor Control: https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=7818#p50895. And isn't this exaggerating a bit. No, not exaggerating, more of a rumor: "in 1 max 2 years from now Pale moon will be an abandonware?" Really, I think only time will tell. Especially since others have been saying this for ages, which hasn't happen.

      @Sinon: True that my friend! @www.com has no idea what he's talking about.

  30. ... March 8, 2017 at 10:58 pm #

    Just don't update. Run in a sandbox (and in a vm) and use common sense with sites you browse.

  31. Reds March 8, 2017 at 11:28 pm #

    Glad I moved to Opera and Cent Browser when I had the chance.

  32. SocialMediaGrandpa March 9, 2017 at 12:48 am #

    Firefox is WontFix

    • smaragdus March 9, 2017 at 12:39 pm #

      @SocialMediaGrandpa
      Exactly!

  33. Graham March 9, 2017 at 2:04 am #

    It's really sad to hear the state into which Mozilla has devolved. Back in the 2000s, they used to be *THE* browser of choice. They helped push forward the open-source movement in a big way by providing an alternative from the buggy, proprietary browsers of the era. They allowed choice and customization and represented an open Internet.

    Those days are sadly long over. Now it seems they're going against their word. It's depressing to hear about more things from the company either shuttering or becoming mandatory rather than optional.

  34. mikef90000 March 9, 2017 at 3:17 am #

    Well, this is depressing and infuriating news. Just went back and quickly evaluated the most important FF feature that I need - a usable Bookmarks Bar. I have 13 folders on my current bar. A Stylish theme removes the space wasting folder icon in FF, but who knows how long that will last.
    - Chrome and Opera still don't cut it. No way to remove the damn icon.
    - Vivaldi doesn't incorporate that feature, and the bookmarks manager seems usable.

    Only the Chrome add-on 'store' has a lot of options, but it is just as difficult to search as the Android 'Play Store'.
    Opera addons are a joke. Haven't found yet what Vivaldi might have.

    Not holding out much hope for Pale Moon since the FF add-on will wither and turn over tremendously.
    I'm not happy to lose access to the lightweight goodness of Ublock Origin.

  35. corectmeifimwrong March 9, 2017 at 4:20 am #

    "The Classic Theme Restorer add-on for Firefox will stop working when Mozilla releases Firefox 57.0 Stable, and Firefox 59.0 ESR."
    It's worth mentioning that it will still work with the branch of 52.x ESR as it will still have a two cycle (12 week) of updates even that the ESR 59 shows up. So:
    52.7 gets released at 27th of February 2018*
    52.8 gets released at 10th of April 2018* (and it 6 week support ends at 22nd of May 2018*)
    https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/organizations/faq/

    *if nothing changes

  36. Ron Nasty March 9, 2017 at 4:43 am #

    Slimjet, I don't care if it has a Vespa engine, damn thing's a rocket ship and is gobsmackingly low on resources.
    Give it a go, there's a Portable version available.
    @Pale Moon? Dead man walking.

  37. Rick A. March 9, 2017 at 5:14 am #

    So much crying and browser fan-boyism in the comments. it's funny. Go use Chrome or Opera and let Google track you and more money off of YOU, or use the sluggish and very slow Vivaldi and stop wasting your time commenting.

    Also, this comment isn't meant to insult anyone or start a comment war, i'm just stating facts.

    • Daja March 9, 2017 at 7:59 am #

      Typical argument of a die hard Mozilla and Chrome route supporter who is happy even if Mozilla removes almost all customization capabilities away from the browser.

      Vivaldi has at least a more healthy opinion towards features and functions. Brave has a better opinion too.

      A Firefox without power user features is a worthless browser. There is already a Chrome/Chromium. Mozilla emulating Chrome for Chrome users benefits is not the way they should go forward.

      Mozilla Firefox is becoming more utter trash as compared to above mentioned browsers because Mozilla is no longer supporting power users needs and features.

      You are defending a garbage group and a garbage browser. Because that is what Mozilla and their product is becoming soon. A simple browser for the most simple user base. It is funny how rabid Mozilla apologists defend the Chrome similar route. Mozilla and their browser can go to hell.

      Mozilla has become nothing less than the longer arm of Google (Chrome) - a corrupted, abused and seriously broken product, developed from the second most largest traitors and disgusting developers right after Opera.

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 6:18 am #

        >Vivaldi has at least a more healthy opinion towards features and functions.

        Then stick with that. You already have a "healthy option" so your bitterness here should be satisfied. Unless you like crying the blues all the time, which is a different problem.

        >Brave has a better opinion too.

        Yeah, like having built-in adware. lol

        Really, get over it. Mozilla isn't going to change for you and your fellow crybabies here. Move on and be happy with your new choice. Whining about the past will get you nowhere.

      • Rick A. March 10, 2017 at 3:59 pm #

        @Daja - Typical argument of someone who whines and bitches about every thing that involves not getting their way, and that thing is automatically "garbage" and made by a "garbage group" and they love it when other people say they're an evil organization and this is the end of them.

        People like you remind me of little kids in the comments of an article or the comments of a YouTube video where they argue over Android and ios/Apple phones or over PlayStation 4 and Xbox One, it's pathetic and i'd be embarrassed.

        "die hard Mozilla and Chrome route supporter" , "You are defending a garbage group and a garbage browser." and "rabid Mozilla apologists" - That's very funny because i just read my original comment that you replied to and i can't seem to find where i said the word "Mozilla", tried defending them or any "group" let alone a "garbage group" and can't even find where i apologized rabidly..... Could you reply and copy and paste that info into another reply for me.

      • Lord Lestat March 11, 2017 at 12:10 pm #

        @www.com and Rick A.:

        You simplicity and features hating users are as i said the reason why all features everywhere get dumbed down instead of them getting more richer and complex. People like you and all the other troopers of Mozilla and Google are their attack group which enable them to destroy customization once and for all. And whats worse, you are following them like naive sheep.

        Everyone who is criticizing Mozilla (or Google) is right. Because Mozilla always was about power users and the advanced users, so why should that 2 user groups not allowed to be vocal about that?

        Fact is Mozilla is betraying that 2 user groups for simpler user groups. They used the first mentioned 2 until they realized that their fight against Google was not able to be won, so now they try to take all simple users away from Chrome to win.

        This includes adding a Chromes feature set, the extension technology, a new engine which is mimicking how Blink does work and last but not least Australis - a Chrome ui similar ui. And on the other side, removing everything which advanced users have been using in the past.

        Btw. Mozilla should be happy that they only are being attacked with words. Because such a betraying organization - especially if they are "raping" the term Open Source the way they do, earn - if we are honest... to be seriously beaten up in the very worst way and much more of where that comes from.

        Mozilla should be happy that none of that guys who are angry are violent guys or otherwise that disgusting assholes would face a serious problem. And yes, the hell yes, they would earn that too if that would happen.

        So, be happy and Mozilla should be happy too that people are civilized and not violent. Also, @www.com you actually would earn being beaten up too seeing how rude and respectless you are acting towards people who love a software being unique and with a non standard feature set - Basically all what Mozilla was in the past and what they are now removing to satisfy you disgusting sheepish people.

      • Lord Lestat March 11, 2017 at 12:32 pm #

        Also, you despicable simple users are not the only ones who have the right to get all what you want.

        That is also the difference to advanced or power users. They understand that both user groups earn their different feature set and they never would want simple functions to be removed from a product just for having it all for themselves.

        But that is the way you guys do argue. You do not like everything which is reaching out beyond a certain minimalist standard and you demand that all what is beyond that certain limit should be removed because you are humiliating that as "bloat".

        Mozilla of the past had developers who had that understanding that different users have the right of a different feature set, while today's Mozilla does obviously neither the leadership or the main developers of that past anymore which provided that more healthier way of reasoning.

        So, you are much more worse than the power and advanced users you hate so much and want them to be gone to have your way only - you are the same like that asshole Mozilla developers of today - you are arrogant fascists who want features to be exterminated. You know, there was also another group once who had a hate like that which was located in Germany. At least the very basics of that hate is what Mozilla has in common with them. And what is the right comment towards people with certain fascist opinions:

        Burn in the everlasting hellfire! Be utterly obliterated down to the very last scrap of fascist ideologies! Mozilla is nothing less than the equivalent of Donald Trump! He hates Muslims, and Mozilla hates power users and avanced users. So every resistance against Mozilla's fascist ideology is the duty of every defender of righteousness!

    • Rick A. March 11, 2017 at 8:34 pm #

      @Lord Lestat - Don't know if you'll see this and i don't really care, but First you don't know if i'm a "power user" or not. You don't know what browsers i use, how i use them and why i use them. You browser cry-baby fanboys are a joke. Why don't all the "power users" get together and build a "power user" browser built for the "power users" and show Mozilla how it's done? Or, if a browser no longer meats your needs, move on and use the browser that's next in your "power user" lineup.

      "You simplicity and features hating users are as i said the reason why all features everywhere get dumbed down instead of them getting more richer and complex." - LMFAO, "complex", yeah, that'll surely get Firefox more users and grow it's user base. What a joke.

      "so why should that 2 user groups not allowed to be vocal about that?" - Who said they weren't? Am i not allowed to be vocal and say what i said in my original comment that started this thread?

      "so now they try to take all simple users away from Chrome to win." - That sounds so childish.

      "removing everything which advanced users have been using in the past." - Add-ons? if not name some examples.

      "Also, you despicable simple users are not the only ones who have the right to get all what you want." - This might be the corniest thing i've read that you typed so far.

      "and they never would want simple functions to be removed from a product just for having it all for themselves." - What simple functions have been removed ?

      "You do not like everything which is reaching out beyond a certain minimalist standard and you demand that all what is beyond that certain limit should be removed because you are humiliating that as "bloat". - Like Firefox Hello being removed, i liked that because i didn't have to download or use another service to voice or video chat with family. There, i gave a removed feature, can you? And by the way, i only saw "power users" bitching over Firefox Hello and calling it "bloat".....

      i literally cannot believe what i just read with the rest of that BS you typed. You just took kiddy fanboy-ism to a WHOLE other realm with that spewed garbage. i literally, can't believe, you took it there.....

      • Lord Lestat March 11, 2017 at 10:38 pm #

        You seem to have an issue to understand that i mean it SERIOUS. Every single word of what i wrote.

        A whole new level? This is more or less part of my 85 pages manifest on which i work since 2013. If you believe that this was a whole new level, believe me, i even haven't started at all!

        Also, i am no fanboy. As i stopped using Firefox way before Australis was released. But why should that stop me from fighting a mortal enemy of the web?

        If there would be a public office for morality crimes done by Open Source organizations and they would have my (still not yet finished) manifest - Mozilla developers would already stand in front of the wall, facing some grim guys!

        Again, let's be happy that we are living in more or less peaceful times (not counting in that bunch of mad terrorist scumbags), because with the right laws and public offices around, people like Mozilla would be already out of business for quite a long time.

        And to the topic of feature removals... All customization features for example which have been part of Firefox 21-22, where the first removals started with version 23 and the rest was removed with version 29, further being limited with the XUL-less versions.

        But that is not my problem, i am NOT using Firefox any longer. But we are facing some serious lack of law and order when you actually really need it and also we are lacking the pure, non corrupted advocates of the same - advocates who are merciless, incorruptible; Advocates - who are determined opponents of sin, ignorance, corruption, falsity, moral depravity...

        Fighters of racism and fascism, and fighters of cartel minions like Mozilla, who has committed all the crimes mentioned as a willless slave of Google while pretty sure not realizing that the stage was already set and they are the fucked ones in the end when all is done and said.

      • Lord Lestat March 11, 2017 at 11:56 pm #

        And even if law and justice would prove to be inadequate means to put Mozilla and Google into their appropriate places....

        These most miserable of all devils and demons who have spawned from the deepest pits of hell will still lose against the pure and spiritually gifted ones who are accomplishing a moral and tradition-conscious way of life ... Those who trust in Christianity and are accompanied of God's wisdom and are aware of the most mightiest weapon of the believer: the Bible... That ones
        can not lose, because God and Jesus are always with them! And their revenge will utterly destroy and demoralize their mortal enemy and their victory will be the most glorious being possible!

        Cui honorem, honorem - Si vis pacem, evita bellum!

      • www.com March 12, 2017 at 9:04 am #

        Looks like @Lord Lestat is bucking for pompous windbag of the year. If he wasn't such a blowhard he'd be humorous.

      • Lord Lestat March 12, 2017 at 1:20 pm #

        @www.com believe what you want. Everyone has to pay for their crimes one day. That applies to the fascists of Mozilla and to simple fascists like you.

        And no god will save you then from the merciless revenge which will hail down upon your shameful heads and obliterates your fascist way of life.

        Yeah even you will have to pay one day and i and many defenders of righteousness will be victorious, because fascist opinion never is going to last! You are nothing less than an ignorant fool who is happy that others are humiliated - guys of your opinion haven't even earned the right to be called merciful human beings, because you are nothing less than a pawn and fascist!

  38. fxusert March 9, 2017 at 5:48 am #

    Pale Moon has the problem that they crippled extensions in their latest version. They also have trouble keeping up to date with Web technologies.

    And you are stuck with the actual original default then, and not a tweaked version like you can have with CTR. It's pretty nasty looking, especially if you use lightweight themes.

    I'm just gonna stick with Firefox ESR 52 until Firefox 60 comes out. If I can't get the tweaks I want by then, I'll just not upgrade. If Pale Moon is still viable by then, I'll give it another look. (If Mozilla does their typical delaying, and CTR it all the way to Firefox ESR 59, I'll use that until Firefox 67 or so comes out.)

  39. Appster March 9, 2017 at 11:02 am #

    I really hate Mozilla by now. They were decent until they decided to introduce the Australis interface back in the Firefox 29 days. They did randomly throw out the Add-On Bar and the small icon mode, they removed the ability to move some important UX elements around freely, they removed tabs on bottom mode, they made the tabs indistinguishable and killed off the separate downloads window. Like, seriously? I decided to not give up yet and was indeed able to restore sanity utilizing the CTR add-on and the Downloads Window add-on. Firefox thus was again restored to a usable state and I even got my squared tabs (actual, readable, distinguishable tabs) back. Then Mozilla has introduced some more bullshit, like ads in about:newtab, Pocket spyware, Hello (Nobody used that crap, that's why they have removed it.), Add-On Signing (aka walled garden), and services (Like Facebook etc., was removed quickly because nobody used it.). Add-On Signing, ads, and Pocket specifically were the reasons for my switch to Waterfox. I am not willing to accept limitations on which add-ons I use, also I am not willing to see ads, or to be spied out by Pocket. Knowing the fate of CTR I am seriously fed up to the point where I consider switching to another browser, especially if Mozilla drags Waterfox down with it. People suggesting SeaMonkey here are uninformed at best, seeing the current state of the project. They won't even survive beyond the Firefox 52 ESR cycle. Pale Moon saved its virtual ass thanks to a rebase on Gecko 38 (what Firefox 38 ESR uses). Before that they have seriously fallen behind regarding web standards. That will - without a doubt - happen again, most likely making another rebase on Gecko 52 necessary. But what then? This project has no future unless they can attract several new developers. I am considering Vivaldi now, seeing how they add new features instead of removing them. However, neither Pale Moon nor Vivaldi will enable me to do the kind of tweaking CTR allowed me to do. So most likely I will freeze Waterfox at version 56 and keep it as my secondary browser next to Vivaldi. Sad days indeed. Mozilla really hates the hardcore fans as it seems. I hope their current direction leads to their demise.

    PS: Did anyone note the absence of Mozilla apologist Sören Hentzschel? Seems like he can't argue in favor of the BS taking place at Mozilla anymore.

    • Appster March 9, 2017 at 11:54 am #

      By the way, this is what Sören Hentzschel has written about Ghacks on his own blog:

      "Brauch ich nicht zu lesen, da nicht repräsentativ. Ich kenne die Seite Ghacks sehr gut und der Martin Brinkmann ist ein klasse Kerl. Aber das Getrolle in den Kommentaren auf dieser Seite ist extrem schlimm. Wer da nicht gegen etwas ist, wird sofort angegriffen. Ich habe es selbst schon erlebt und auch bei anderen Kommentatoren auf dieser Seite beobachtet. Deswegen habe ich mich dort auch schon stark zurückgezogen. Das Kommentar-Niveau dort ist mir zu niedrig. Und das wurde in den letzten Monaten schlimmer, nicht besser."

      This roughly translates to (for people who are non-fluent in German):

      "I don't have to read them (the comments on ghacks), as they are not representative. I know this site very well and Martin Brinkmann is a great guy. However, the trolling in the comment section of the site is quite deplorable. People who are not against anything there will be attacked immediately. I have experienced that multiple times already, the same with like-minded commenters on this site. This is why I have withdrawn myself quite a bit from there. The standard of the comments there is too low for my liking. During the last months this has become worse rather than better."

      Source: https://www.soeren-hentzschel.at/firefox/welche-erweiterungen-koennen-in-firefox-57-wie-geladen-werden/

      Great guy indeed.

      • lord lestat March 9, 2017 at 12:27 pm #

        Well, there is only one source issue which creates the problem with the decreasing posting quality: Mozilla themselves.

        As i wrote earlier: "Mozilla shows that they have not the tiniest bit of respect - none for their users and also non for awesome add-on developers like Aris and Classic Theme Restorer."

        So how should a user react who is still using Firefox or may not use Firefox anymore but sees that everything what Mozilla once represented is dragged by that "frigging morons" through hell and beyond? In a friendly supportive way? Alone the idea makes me smile sarcastically :D

        All the shitstorms lately are in the end caused by Mozilla. And here is a fun fact, it all could have been avoided if so called power users would still get the same dedication and support like Mozilla offers today for the the most simplistic userbase which is targeted by them right now.

        Normally it should be the job of people like Soeren to tell Mozilla that it is nothing bad to keep features which made them special and not going down the mimicking Chrome direction.

        But the problem is, exactly that kind of people is perfect in line with Mozilla's now direction. They want it minimalist, they want customization gone, they want the Chrome style so badly like Mozilla wants it too. And then that special Firefox/Mozilla supporters complain too that they are blamed and attacked too.

        But Appster, Soeren is the smallest piece of that whole issue and he earns for sure the least amount of attacks.

        The one which should be blamed instead is Mozilla.

        As i said earlier: "Mozilla is today a corrupted organization and nothing is going to change in that department in the future."

        Mozilla is the same like Opera. Mozilla has discarded the right to call themselves Open Source. Because Open Source projects are making wise and intelligent decisions and are caring for their own users without replacing them for other users because they suddenly become too greedy.

        I would not call that exactly "scum" like others did - but it is indeed a jerk reaction and only assholes would act like that.

      • Appster March 9, 2017 at 1:14 pm #

        @lord lestat: You are right. I mean, if we are perfectly honest we could say that there will be no reason to use Firefox anymore once Firefox 57 hits. Firefox is neither faster nor more private than other browsers. It doesn't have the better default interface either. What makes Firefox great is extensions. Mozilla obviously fails to understand this and refuses to change its direction whatever their main add-on developers might claim. They are purposefully dumbing down Firefox immensely to the point where a switch to Chrome is painless. Are they really hoping to attract new users by offering the same thing their competitor offers? If so, then it makes no sense to comment on them at all. I will make the switch to Vivaldi most likely, since I will get the Chrome extensions there as well + a largely customizable interface. Pale Moon won't survive without the option to rebase on a new Gecko engine anyway. SeaMonkey is dead man walking. I completely understand people being angry at Mozilla since they give enough reason to be angry at them. Opera had the same kind of attitude as you have pointed out... And it brought them nowhere. As for "Open Source", well... Open Source projects can make dumb decisions as well. Open Source just means that the code is accessible by the public. Nothing more, nothing less. Open Source projects tend to make smarter decisions since they mostly listen to their fanbase, but complaints fall onto deaf ears over there at Mozilla. So Mozilla is essentially an example of an Open Source project being brought down by incompetent leadership.

        As for Sören: I got banned from his site for being too critical about the Australis interface back in the day. He is always right and what he says largely fits what Mozilla claims. He sometimes comes over here to explain the bullshit decisions Mozilla has made the best he can. I am frequently calling him out on his attitude, and this is why he doesn't like me all too much. Luckily he has no power over the comment section here. Martin on the other hand is quite neutral and lets positive as well as critical voices through. People like Sören will most likely have no impact on Mozilla's direction. Quite the opposite. They are making things worse by defending the very things loyal users would harshly criticize.

      • tommi March 9, 2017 at 2:25 pm #

        i think sören actually is quite a nice and helpful guy, though he is very stubborn when it comes to firefox.
        sometimes he even has a point (from a webdesigners view), but he defends almost everything the mozilla clowns are coming up with.

      • lord lestat March 9, 2017 at 2:27 pm #

        Appster, but almost no Open Source project replaces their own users with another class of users.

  40. Sock March 9, 2017 at 2:10 pm #

    Appster and Lestat / Celtic_superhero, does the word antishill exist ?

    Cuz that's what you sound like, article after article. We got your opinion, you don't need to spam it and we could do without the ad hominem, too ;_;

    PS: Not wasting my time replying to huge walls of text, you've already said everything you had to say anyway, almost feels like I could write your own replies down below if I cared ^_^'

    I wonder if participation or visit statistics of Ghacks have diminished recently. Hope not.

    • Lord Lestat March 9, 2017 at 6:38 pm #

      Something short.

      If there is a big injustice and a previously trustworthy and righteous organization is attacking that certain people who had been vocal and supportive all the time, never be silent!

      If such an organization or a single person is suddenly starting abusive behavior it is the only right thing to stand up and be vocal, no matter if this means standing up against a friend who suddenly has decided to beat you up, a developer who suddenly decides your opinion is suddenly worth nothing or a country ruled by a tyrant who restricts the freedom of others.

      Being silent means allowing the other party have a full and flawless victory.

      This situation is not different. And no matter how much you have to stand up and be vocal again, never be silent, never allow the attacker to have a 100% victory.

      • www.com March 10, 2017 at 6:23 am #

        @Lord Lestat, it's only a browser, not God. You sound ridiculous.

        What @Sock said. Get over it and move on.

      • lord lestat March 10, 2017 at 9:51 am #

        Again, i am not going to be silent, just because a developer team which consists of (giving them the benefit of doubth) still somewhat human beings and their rabid followers could fee humiliated by the truth.

        Me and others will always call Mozilla what the are: a team which has no right to exist because it is basically Google today. And all what they earn is being beaten up by words or similar. Again and again. Because they want it that way. And assholes simply earn nothing better when they are assholes on purpose.

  41. msel March 9, 2017 at 2:11 pm #

    @Appster
    PaleMoon is not Gecko based anymore - it has its own engine (Goanna-based web browser) - which is a modified and up-to-date version of Gecko (no security holes). Therefore some (but not a lot) extensions of AMO won't run in PaleMoon or there are other extensions which are created to replace them (e. g. Crush Those Cookies for Self-Destructing Cookies). So PaleMoon is now independent from the Gecko Engine and from the development of Mozilla Firefox (the same is applied for FossaMail - it has not the Gecko Engine but the Goanna Engine now). So PaleMoon / FossaMail are becoming more and more independent from other Mozilla projects - but they save the best of the original Mozilla Firefox.

    • Appster March 9, 2017 at 3:42 pm #

      Yeah, I know they are using "Goanna". However, Goanna is still largely Gecko so it is fair to still call them Gecko-based. How else could they rebase their browser on Gecko 38 (Pale Moon 27) so easily? The rebase was necessary because they have fallen behind regarding web standards as their main developer Moonchild has pointed out. They simply don't have the capacity/manpower to permanently develop their own engine unless they can attract several new developers to their project. I have never put into question that Pale Moon is secure, though. After all Moonchild is backporting fixes from new Firefox iterations. Yet the burden of maintaining XUL will be entirely on them once Mozilla drops it. Whether they can stem it or not remains to be seen, I just have serious doubts. Would be positively surprised if they could, though.

      • ZippyDSMlee March 9, 2017 at 3:50 pm #

        Couldn't they support XUL via restricted approved addons from their addon site that double checks addons every now and then to ensure they are secure, then allow a free for all mode that's up to the user to patch all the security holes if they want to run hinky addons?

  42. Straspey March 9, 2017 at 2:12 pm #

    Download Netscape Navigator v 9.0.0.6 - and go back to those simple days of yesteryear - when a browser was a simple tool designed to browse the internet.

    http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/netscape_navigator_for_windows.html

    • Heimen Stoffels March 10, 2017 at 10:21 am #

      ... except that Netscape isn't very secure to use anymore. Besides, there are modern alternatives that are designed to just browse the internet, like Web (formerly Epiphany but mostly Linux-only), QupZilla (cross-platform browser)... just to name a few.

  43. myname March 9, 2017 at 2:15 pm #

    What about All in One Sidebar? OmniSidebar is dying, so if the other one is too, then I'll have to switch to Opera/Vivaldi.

  44. ZippyDSMlee March 9, 2017 at 2:29 pm #

    Heres a dumb Q....why would you lock any of the UI up? Assuming you have to click a few confirmation boxes to okay the changes and to load a mod the first time can not be done automatically... I'm not seeing the issue...... you load your UI theme or keep to default, default can be minimized till there is nothing left leavening the rest of us who use the UI to enjoy our tweaks......

    • Heimen Stoffels March 10, 2017 at 10:25 am #

      Agreed. Or maybe a hidden preference in about:config to enable an "Advanced mode" for power users who want to tweak a lot more. No simple user is going to enable/add a hidden preference in about:config anyway and power users won't mind enabling/adding a hidden preference to get what they want so that would be a great solution IMHO.

  45. RPWheeler March 9, 2017 at 5:02 pm #

    There are several ad-dons which I use quite often. Without them I'll have much less reasons (if have any) to use Firefox. It seems that in the end of 2017 Firefox will stop to be my working browser (for now I still use it next to Chrome, but _only_ because it has add-ons which I don't have in Chrome).

    As for my home PC, in the next months I'll look into switching back to Pale Moon (which was my browser of choice in 2010-2014).

    2 of my relatives probably will do some switch as well: they like FF changes no more than me.

  46. mikef90000 March 9, 2017 at 9:54 pm #

    I decided to do a 'test run' without CTR and rediscovered the Australis idiocy of Mozilla removing the add-on toolbar OPTION. To regain access to Ublock Origin, FEBE, the built-in zoom controller, etc controls I have to add them back to the crowded bookmark bar or the crowded 'URL/search' toolbar. Dammit, dammit.

    • ZippyDSMlee March 9, 2017 at 10:22 pm #

      I use mutlirow toolbar.

    • ShintoPlasm March 9, 2017 at 11:09 pm #

      Without CTR I no longer have the coloured 'secure/non-secure' indicators in the location bar, the version numbers in the add-ons page, and - most irritatingly - the close buttons on each tab are back to being on the right-hand side. Close buttons should be on the left when you're using a Mac, and only Opera keeps to this aesthetic by default. So annoying!

  47. ShintoPlasm March 9, 2017 at 10:02 pm #

    The twins of Mammon quarrelled. Their warring plunged the world into a new darkness, and the beast abhorred the darkness. So it began to move swiftly, and grew more powerful, and went forth and multiplied. And the beasts brought fire and light to the darkness.
    from The Book of Mozilla, 15:1

    Remember when Firefox used to be the professionals' choice? When they had those little geeky Easter eggs like the Book of Mozilla verses? How did Mozilla become the antithesis of all they used to stand for? I'm very sad.

    • Swicher March 10, 2017 at 12:55 am #

      The following is more up to date:
      The Beast stumbled in the dark for it could no longer see the path. It started to fracture and weaken, trying to reshape itself into the form of metal.
      Even the witches would no longer lay eyes upon it, for it had become hideous and twisted.
      The soul of the Beast seemed lost forever.
      Then, by the full moon's light, a child was born; a child with the unbridled soul of the Beast that would make all others pale in comparison.
      from the Chronicles of the Pale Moon, 24:2

  48. Ron Nasty March 10, 2017 at 1:54 am #

    How? Mozilla became a Cult, and Firefox is their in house ATM to finance the real 'mission'.
    Nothing short of the removal of the majordomo[s] will save the sinking ship.

  49. TelV March 13, 2017 at 8:12 pm #

    For a minute there I felt quite depressed. CTR is an essential extension for me because it allows me to move tabs below the location bar and losing it would reintroduce the default google chrome style which I hate.

    But then I saw pintassilgo's link above and one of the comments below that pointed to Pale Moon which I just took a look at. That seems to have tabs below the location bar already so I'll try it towards the end of the week to see what it's like and which extensions it supports.

    It's great shame though that Mozilla won't provide the API to enable CTR to become a WE. If you look at the number of menus it contains which lets users customize FF to their own liking it's incomprehensible that they would refuse to provide the API to do the job.

    I think Firefox's market share will plummet dramatically when v57 comes into play because Mozilla is going to lose a huge chunk of their loyal user base with this absurd decision. And once gone, it'll be that much harder to get them back again. If ever.

    • ZippyDSMlee March 13, 2017 at 8:32 pm #

      I switched from Vivaldi to palemoon, I give up on anything chrome related, until they offer plugins not from the Chrome store and offer near full GUI customize plugins. Basically we need a new firefox with its own plugin database thats not handicapped by google and high corporate...

      I don't need HTML 5 as long a script blocker of some kind is updated for it an older browser will be good enough for me.

      • TelV March 13, 2017 at 8:40 pm #

        Youtube video defaults to HTML5 though.

      • ZippyDSMlee March 13, 2017 at 8:53 pm #

        TelV True but I am not having any issue with Palemoon, so it works well enough with HTML 5.

  50. Sergej28 March 19, 2017 at 4:31 am #

    This is serious. Since Firefox 47 and above broke the support for the best Findbar Tweak version I ever used which was already an issue for me (and no future versions will be working for the newest firefox version since the developer had to give up on this blockade) now even the Classic Theme Restorer -Addon is affected by the rampage of Mozilla.
    Seems it will be regardless if one chooses a non australis firefox alternative or just firefox alternative. However we will see soon how this plays out.
    I ditched IE for Opera already.
    If mozilla thinks they are cool I might even consider chrome, vivaldi or some blink one in the future as a replacement.
    And only keep using an outdated (pre australis) one for compability reasons when it comes to java support.

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